Skip to main content

Wicked one, why do you strike your fellow man?

By ReligionFebruary, 2008December 7th, 20234 min read

It seems that open letters are all the rage in our community in recent weeks, so I have to put my hat in the ring. The debate regarding “Yechi” that has simmered in our shul for many years has recently risen to a fever pitch in recent months.

Fortunately, Australia has been largely insulated from much of the ugly community fights that have emerged since Gimmel Tammuz. This is probably due to a combination of things – a lack of extremists on either side of the fence, and a lack of leadership to take a firm and public stand either way.

The sign in our Shul does not bother me in the slightest – I spend most of my time facing the front anyway (shouldn’t we all?), and I do genuinely want Moshiach to come.

There are a few things that do bother me, however.

People are entitled to their own beliefs, and there exists a broad spectrum of beliefs in our community regarding Lubavitch, the Rebbe, and Moshiach. In amongst all of these beliefs, people seem to have forgotten some basic principles: Ahavas Yisroel, and Derech Eretz.

If someone takes a different position to me, I respect their right to do that, and I expect no less from them regarding my own position. But when calling out Yechi or dancing after davening changes from the expression of a belief to a deliberately provocative, almost militant declaration, its original intent (to hasten the coming of Moshiach) rapidly fades. And that is what the declarations of some of the more extreme elements of our shul have changed to. This sort of behaviour will not bring Moshiach, because it is divisive and disrespectful of others, and these are behaviours that go against everything the Rebbe stood for.

The only thing I can think of that is worse than this, is the act of raising one’s hand against another Jew. That people have come to physical blows in our Shul and surrounds over this issue truly sickens and disgusts me. What right does anyone have to escalate a verbal dispute into a physical one, and to strike another person? Anyone who does this (from either side of the political fence) should be censured in the strongest terms. Is a fist fight in Shul going to bring Moshiach closer?

My final gripe is not regarding a specific action, but rather the total absence of action. Our Shul and our community has a Rabbi, a Head Shliach, a Dayan, but they have been all but silent on this issue. Should we have a Yechi sign in the shul or not? What is our official policy on the Rebbe and Moshiach? The leadership do have views on these issues, but have been sadly unwilling or unable to articulate them in a clear way to their constituents. What is the job of leaders if not to lead?

It seems that the most basic principles of Ahavas Yisroel, and respect for leadership have been left behind, and in their place we now have the awful, insatiable, desire to be right, expressed by protagonists on both sides. There is a simple test to determine if a specific behaviour or action is the correct one. Ask yourself: will this bring Moshiach closer? Will this give nachas to the Rebbe? Let’s all get back to basics – these are the immutable and timeless principles that have kept us together for generations.

Print Friendly, PDF & Email

Join the discussion 263 Comments

  • Dr Qui says:

    Well considered, well put and very true.
    The litmus test of behaviour HAS to be “will this hasten Moshiach’s arrival?” and “would The Rebbe OBM approve?” If the answer to either question is “no” then how can such behaviour be justified?
    My concern is how this matter will be resolved. At what point will egos be laid aside long enough for derech eretz to prevail? For how long will people manipulate what they read in Igeres Ha Kodesh to justify any action, no matter how insane?
    I feel most sorry for the families of these men. Let’s make sure we show them our support and do not tar them with the same brush.

  • Anonymous says:

    A couple of pointers:
    “…a lack of leadership to take a firm and public stand either way…”
    True leadership does not always equal “taking a firm and public stand either way”. In many situations, the opposite is true.

    “…Our Shul and our community has a Rabbi, a Head Shliach, a Dayan, but they have been all but silent on this issue…”
    They have taken the following actions:
    1. They initially posted a sign saying that the two individuals should not collect Tzedakah until they follow instructions.
    2. They recently posted a sign that nobody may make declarations of any sort, without permission from the rov, dayan, or gabboim.
    3. The dayan has on several occasions found it necessary to hold up the Tefillos, because of this issue.
    4. The Rov made an announcement in Kollel about this issue.
    So why on earth do you think that they have been silent?

    “Should we have a Yechi sign in the shul or not?
    I think that the position of our Rabbi, Head Shliach, and Dayan is pretty clear on this issue.

    “ What is our official policy on the Rebbe and Moshiach? The leadership do have views on these issues, but have been sadly unwilling or unable to articulate them in a clear way to their constituents. What is the job of leaders if not to lead?”
    Again, true leadership sometimes requires silence. The reason the leadership have not broadcasted their views is quite obvious – because they do not see the issue as clear-cut black-and-white, and as such, every individual should be able to form their own (informed) view.
    Be honest David, if the leadership articulated their opinion “in a clear way to their constituents”, and their opinion did not exactly conform to your perspective of the issue, would you allow yourself “to be lead”?

  • Anonymous says:

    Well said. You have clearly echoed the sentiments of many.

  • Dov Werdiger says:

    Hi David,

    One comment: In Economics there is a concept called expectations, the expectations always lead to the expected outcome. (For instance, when everyone thinks Inflation will rise, this leads to an actual rise in Inflation.)

    The same rule applies here: Most people are ignorant of any facts involved in this so called dispute. For all anyone knows there may not even be a dispute. Suddenly, everyone is talking about the dispute and reading open letters.
    Where will this eventuate?
    In a dispute.

    The facts are; the Shul and its committee and its leaders and most of its members openly believe that the Rebbe, their Rebbe, is Moshiach. There is no dispute, so there is no need for proclamations and there is definitely no need to throw anyone out of shul.

    I will tell what there is a need for though; proaction, motivation, involvement for all parts of the community.
    I hear the cry of the 3 people in question, they are not crying out Yechi to instigate a dispute, they are crying out in the only language they know.
    It is time for this community to get out of its choke-hold.

    I respect them, because I haven’t the confidence, the self esteem, or the courage to cry out myself.

    How long do we want our kids to be too afraid to go to the toilet during playtime because there is no control in our schools?
    How long do we want to drive our young married couples away to the furthest corners of the world rather than keep them here, where they are needed desperately?
    And with all our bickering and complaining, how long are we going to alienate our Youth, our future, with our misconceptions and misperceptions?

    We are the instigators, because we are too apathetic to even listen.

    What use is Leader without a Nation?

    Dov

  • Anonymous says:

    Dov should now stop being a closet messiachist nuisance and come out an be a public one.He and his like will then most certainly be mekarev the youth, bring the married couples closer to Yiddishkeit, and then he can display his respect for his heroes openly.
    They may even become his mashpi’im since they are such great representatives of the Rebbe, Chabad and Lubavitch.
    Dov, if most of us will expect for you and your heroes to go away, will you? This after all, this is “the concept in economics”! I sure am hoping for this “expected” outcome.

  • mispallel says:

    Dov, You are out of touch with reality. Please do not speak on behalf of the silent majority who believe this Moshiach cult is crazy. If these 2-3 people cannot behave themselves and accept our communual shule with respect they should be forcefully removed as Rabbi Cohen has suggested. Why should we allow every meshuganah to make our shule into a circus. Every one can cry out to Hashem as they like , but quietly without disturbing other misspallelim. I have a sick child but I do not scream the shule down. We are loosing respect by most of our congregants.
    It is well known what most educators claim, the reason our children are leaving Lubavitch is mainly due to the Meshiachists!!

  • Anonymous says:

    Dov says

    Dov – How long do we want our kids to be too afraid to go to the toilet during playtime because there is no control in our schools?

    Care to expand?

    Dov – How long do we want to drive our young married couples away to the furthest corners of the world rather than keep them here, where they are needed desperately?

    How so? How many if any of our young married couples have been driven away from our shores? Our young, like you, marry overseas for several reasons, a) they think the grass is greener there b) like you they think there is no one here good enough for them c) there aren’t enough fish in the ocean here d) unlike you, they wish to do Shlichus but there aren’t enough opportunities here e) unlike you, their families here do not have the resources to support them indefinately.

    So what the heck are you on about?

    And whilst you’re “outing” yourself with your new found heroes anything else you’d like to “come out of the closet” on?

    Is eccentricity a family trait?

  • Anonymous says:

    The issues of leadership and community cohesion, harmony, achdut which dominate the discussion of our three rebels’ behaviour is all valid.

    However there is an aspect which has not been discussed: In general how should one react to the direct words of a gadol? For better or worse one can’t make a halocho lemaaseh from the words of a gadol unless he directed you personally to undertake an activity. Even if the gadol has directed the whole community to do something, you will need to consult the other leaders of the gadol’s generation and see what they have to say about the gadol’s words and directives. The leaders will, according to Torah principles, interpret the gadol’s words and they’ll tell people what to actually do.

    So our rebels would be on much stronger grounds if instead of quoting the Rebbe as their proof source, they started quoting other gedolim who interpret the Rebbe’s message in the manner that they want. If indeed a majority of the Rebbe’s junior colleagues – ie the Chabad leaders of this generation and the previous generation – DO interpret the Rebbe’s words the same way our rebels do, then it would behove the Shule majority to re-think its position.

    Howevewr, I don’t think that a majority follows the rebels’ opinion, and therefore their opinion becomes simply an opinion which doesn’t translate to maaseh, at least not in the way that they want.

    Yiddishkeit is full of statements which don’t translate into maaseh for many reasons. But the underlying general reason why a gadol’s words don’t translate into action is because the leadership community always interprets the words and defines under what circumstances those words translate to action.

    Our rebels don’t understand this process.

  • Dov Werdiger says:

    Firstly, I don’t respond to people who can’t put their name behind what they say.
    Or is that what makes me an eccentric?

    Let’s not get confused here. You have your opinion and I have mine, I am not saying I am right and you are wrong. We are all entitled to our own opinion however they were formed.

    It seems that if any positive action or clarity were to come out of this, it would require people to be honest with each other, and leave out any useless smearing.

    There seem to be issues alot deeper and more important than what we believe to be Moshiach.

    I am open to any response, I just wish you would please write your name.
    Thank you.
    Dov

  • Squashing civil communal debate regarding philosophical differences among Chassidim would prove to be counter productive. Having healthy discussions of differing opinions within our community is a sign that we are a dynamic group of thinkers, and that we are not a monolith of brain washed cultists. The Gemorah is replete with engaging and often sharp yet respectful discourses, and the art of argument is a quintessentially Jewish way of interacting.

    Chabad has been squabbling, sometimes with great acrimony, over the Yechi issue for nearly a decade and a half. I have vociferously opposed the Yechi ideology after doing extensive research and can back up my views with sources, not with mere emotionally charged mantras. Those avowed Yechiniks who are willing to engage in an impassioned but reasoned and respectful debate are far and few between. It has been my personal experience that the Yechiniks are in general quite intolerant and unable to debate point by point cogently without resorting to making personal attacks. One of the most common accusations Yechiniks heap on their opponents is that we are not the real Chassidim, making aspersions that anyone who does not swallow their rhetoric whole is somehow spiritually deficient and has weak hiskashrus to the Rebbe. I have always found this to be most disconcerting and would welcome a truly fair and open debate between knowledgeable parties.

    We as Chabadniks understand the power of symbols and how these symbols promote ideas. Shluchim use propaganda all the time, as there is nothing wrong with this because they use it towards a holy goal. The banner in the shule is such a propaganda symbol, and as such its impact cannot be minimised nor denied. The Yechi banner is a loud statement saying that this shule and its leadership is taking sides with the Yechiniks. For this same leadership to now insist that their fellow travellers in the Yechi ideology abandon their true beliefs is more than slightly hypocritical. Furthermore, the shule leadership’s declarations and actions to quelch the vocal Yechiniks in our midst now ring most hollow. Their authority has been undermined by the tacit and overt support they have given to the Yechi movement. They simply cannot try and straddle both sides of the fence and expect to be effective leaders.

  • Anonymous says:

    On a lighter note: anon says: “…should now stop being a closet messiachist nuisance and come out an be a public one…”. am i right in assuming that the name Yechi-el Belfer implies something?

  • Dov Werdiger says:

    Yechiel, was that you mate?
    That’s a suprise. Didn’t know this bothered you so much.

  • Anonymous says:

    I do not often agree with Silcove, but she is 100% correct. We have created a monster than has come to haunt us. These fanatics do not know any limits. Every year they become more extreme and more loony. Either we get rid of this propoganda and focus on being a normal shule as a shule was through the generations or we let every meshugana behave like clowns every time their toe tickles!

  • Anonymous says:

    Groner sat on the fence and the fence eventually broke!

  • Anonymous says:

    Ok, Dov. I’ll use my real name.
    It’s Yisroel Paltiel here. (Even though it says “anonymous” – I am too lazy to set up a Google account)

    Question for you:

    How do you know as “fact” what “most of the members” think? (leaving aside the question of how you define “member” for another blog post).

    People who start things off with “most people would agree with me” are asking for trouble.

  • Anonymous says:

    I have just one comment:

    David Werdiger has never had so many comments on his blog. Also look at the passion of the writers.

    Watch out Emmanuel there is a new computer super power!

  • Anonymous says:

    SHoshana Silcove wrote:

    The Yechi banner is a loud statement saying that this shule and its leadership is taking sides with the Yechiniks. For this same leadership to now insist that their fellow travellers in the Yechi ideology abandon their true beliefs is more than slightly hypocritical.

    It seems like you don’t comprehend what most people do: The Yechi banner is an issue of Yechi, whereas the vocal declarations of “those three” is not about Yechi, for their agenda had degenerated into a strange and senseless “hodge-podge-ology” of militancy, attention-seeking and extremism.

    As you yourself imply, differing opinions within a community are a sign of its health; crazed extremism is not! Thus, this “double-standard” is not hypocrisy; it is healthy, and essential!

  • Without any banners the Yechi issue would have remained a personal and private one for each individual to decide for themselves. This is as it should be. The minute the Yechi sign appeared, the Rabbinical leaders of the shule lent this school of thought their public stamp of approval thereby foisting their own personal sympathies on the rest of us. This turned it into a matter of public policy, and those who opposed the Yechi viewpoint were immediately put on the defensive against the shule leadership. This opened up the floodgates that has led to this present machlokes.

  • Dov Werdiger says:

    Dear Yisroel,

    Firstly, you don’t know me or my circumstance at all, so please don’t jump to any rash conclusions about how or why I live here.

    In all the emotion my point seems to be lost on you.

    The same short term vision that plagues others in your generation has obviously rubbed out on yourself.

    As a young married person living in this wonderful city, the only security I feel for a brighter future is the fact that finally after 5 years a new principle has been hired, and finally however many years too late, we have another Rabbinic authority who can attempt to lead us.
    I am excited at these prospects, so it seems a little petty that a 10 year old dispute is being brought up again.
    Exactly what our new leadership needs.

    No matter what the outcome, I can’t see a positive influence in any direction. Especially if Police get involved.
    We did the Shul sign thing years ago, twice.

    For me, and I can’t speak for my whole generation, just my opinion, remember, I couldn’t care less about this dispute. It is tiring and depressing.
    It only shows how vulnerable we are as a community and how much further we need to progress in order to return to the path that was started by Yeshivah’s Founders.

  • Anonymous says:

    The sign has not done any good just causes Machloykas. It’s time to get rid of it for once and for all.
    The hall can be used for banners and chantings! Let the hall be a circus for Zelig, Alex and any other clown and let the shule be a shule we can all daven to Hashem with dignity and proper decorum!

  • Anonymous says:

    Re: Rabbi Yitzchak Schochet, Mill Hill Synagogue 15/02/2008
    “As for those declaring the Lubavitcher Rebbe, of blessed memory, to be the presumed Messiah, their vivid imagination to think of themselves as inspired prophets..”

    It was the Lubavitcher Rebbe who declared himself to be the Messiah on many occasions. The four that I will mention are 1) The Rebbe’s express confirmation to Rabbi Groner to allow the title Melech Hamoshiach to be used in the book Besuras Hageulo published by Kehos, the offical Lubavitch publishing house. Rabbi Groner asked the Rebbe three questions to confirm beyond doubt the Rebbe’s wishes on this matter 2) When presented with a Rabbinic ruling denoting the Rebbe to be Melech Hamoshiach, signed by the 5 most prominent Rabbis in Lubavitch in 1991, including Rabbi Heller and Rabbi Ashkenazi, the Rebbe answered “Yeyasher Koach” 3) When presented a list of ladies who signed a letter accepting the Rebbe as Messiah ( video exists), the Rebbe explicitly encouraged the ladies to continue signing up more and more ladies 4) The Rebbe said “Moshiach’s name is Menachem” and “that he lives in 770”

    The Rebbe vigorously encouraged the
    vocal singing and dancing of Yechi in the 770 SHUL for over a year in front of thousands.

    The Lubavitcher Rebbe does not require Lubavitchers to implement “damage control”. The Rebbe decides policy in Lubavitch and no-one else. That is what a Rebbe is all about. You either believe in him or you don’t. As the saying goes, a woman can’t be half pregnant.

  • Anonymous says:

    Dov – It is tiring and depressing.
    It only shows how vulnerable we are as a community and how much further we need to progress in order to return to the path that was started by Yeshivah’s Founders.

    As if your late great grandfather would admire these rabble-rousers, your new found super heroes who respect no one other than their incredible ability to consult igros nightly and magically receive the exact answers which justify their disrespect for rabbonim, including your “another Rabbinic authority who can attempt to lead us. The rabbonim either have the authority to lead or they don’t. As Rabbi Groner said in the kollel on shabbos, the rebbe always stressed that people had to listen to rabbonim. That is beyond dispute. Your glorification of these rabble earns you no respect, no matter what your reasons are. Reb Zalman a’h could never have aligned himself with such people, particularly if he saw the machloikess they cause by not backing down from their extremism.

  • admin says:

    To Anonymous(1),

    Our leadership have done too little, too late. For years they stood back while this steadily escalated. Some months ago they evicted several people who were in direct defiance of them, and in just a short time, they were right back in shul, and all the more militant for it.

    Their own lack of action on this and other matters has contributed to the lack of respect shown by members of the shul at large.

  • admin says:

    Some recent comments are turning into a to and fro between meshichists and anti-meshichists. That was certainly not the intent – indeed, my original post was neutral in that issue (in my opinion).

    My call was for Ahavas Yisroel and Derech Eretz – a great place to start would be on this very blog!

  • Dov Werdiger says:

    Who is glorifying the rabble rousers? All I am saying is read between the lines.
    What I am saying is Moshiach and Yechi talk – is mere symptom relief.

    Stop thinking Panadol when we need open heart surgery.

    I don’t agree with their provocation, and I certainly think the bigots who respond with physical and verbal abuse are even worse, far worse.
    However, I saw how it all started in the Kollel as a desperate attempt to inspire others, and from cynical rejection it has escalated into a full blown self inflicted dispute.

    All because of apathetic symptom relief.

    I also feel that as a junior member of this community, I have over stepped any privilege I may have had to comment on the situation thus far. So I would like to refrain from commenting further.
    My one off emotional splurge is over.
    Thanks.

  • Anonymous says:

    I can Not believe that this is still a discussion in Melbourne, i am a former Aussie (once and Ocher always…) but currently living in CH. this should have been a burnt out issue as it is becoming in the US and Israel. It’s a few radicals and that is ALL. no one else mate. most of them in CH don’t have jobs or normalcy in their respective families and Yisroel, yes, you can come and see numbers and statistics. it IS turning away our children but Bezeras Hashem Yisborech Moshiach will come shortly, we hope the Rebbe, but I’m sure the Rebbe will be just as happy if it will not be him.

  • Avraham says:

    ……I actually was under the impression that the individuals’ that our Rabbonim refered to (without names) on Shabbos in the Kollel, was the repeated offenders – the 3 indivudals who swooped down and physically (like an F16 – even though it was shabbos) and verbally (with fire coming out of their mouth) attacked 3 innocent mispallim.

    I myself, still davening was knocked over!.

    One poor fellow was on the floor screaming (“PLEASE DONT TOUCH ME!”)How he got on the floor is a problem “al pi Torah” in itself, I would think?!

    It may even be so that, these 3 individuals, were not even davening in the Kollel minyan.

    How did they arrive and for what purpose?

    Maybe to extract some kind of punishment or to execute some kind of swift judgement?

    I did read a Psak Din early that morning. I sincerely hope that the “declaration” they made to 3 innocent mispallim to “GET OUT OF THIS SHUL!!!!” and further physically execute an act of violence contrary to our Holy Torah, is conveyed to the Rabonim, without delay!

    As for the interpretaion of the Psak Din, I would think that the Rabbis who made it, have the knowledge and ability to interprete any infridgment of it and I trust that ONLY they themselves (not the growing number of voluntary Shotrim) will know what to do.

    What is most disturbing, is that these “declarations” of “GET OF THIS SHUL!) have happened on previous occasions in complete disregard to the recent Psak Din.

    Not being a Rabbi or a halachic expert, my small knowledge of Torah laws directs me to the crime of “physical abuse”, which may also have been perpetrated, G-d forbid!

    Can a fellow blogger kindly direct me/us (because we are all in it together -chaverim) to which Torah law may have been abrogated, so I/we or our Rabbis can kindly offer the correct Tshuvah to rectify a possible averah, ASAP.

    May Hashem bless our holy Rabbi’s with strength, to inbue us with respect for each other, including our physical space, property AND individual ways to bring Moshiach NOW!

  • Anonymous says:

    for everyone’s information…. there is publicized psak din put together in 1998(post gimmel tammuz), which states that REBBE is Moshiach and instructs Am Israel to proclaim and publicize it to everyone in this generation. signed by 250+ chabad and non chabad rabbonim, including Rabbi T. Telsner, Rabbi CT. Groner and alike.

    MOSHIACH NOW!

    elka

  • elka, so what’s your point? We already know alot of people have that belief, but that doesn’t make it any less mistaken. After all, the majority of yidden, including great Rabbonim, all believed the Shabtai Tzvi was also Moshiach, and they were wrong.

  • Anonymous says:

    the point is very clear. what kind of respect deserves a rav who signs 2 psaks that totally contradict each other? where will this kind of “leader” lead his community?

    elka

  • Anonymous says:

    Australia is not different! For an entire year the Rebbe encouraged yechi after Mincha & mariv! why is australia different?! Only in 770 should my kids be able to say yechi? Because 1 or 2 or even 3 finaly stand up and say enough is enough! Religious Freedom! Yechi should be anounced! This is not a psak it has no halachik source. plus it never says you cant say yechi. If you take it at face value you cant say anything out loud(it doesn’t mention Yechi) any chazan would have to get written permission. I wonder legaly if it was challenged in court it would have any validity?! These two peices of paper on the wall is pure incitement of people in the name of the rabonim. And the people who made this chilul hashem are these rabonim! At least they should have written next to it nobody could raise a hand to another jew. I am sure they could have found plenty of sources for such a psak.
    I would not be surprised if that was the intention to get the kehila to physicaly throw them out.
    Something the Rebbe would never do. These Rabonim should make a cheshbon Hanefesh tear down the signs either anounce Yechi themselves or get someone to or even let anybody anounce yechi!

  • Anonymous says:

    Hey Avraham,
    I dig you, my friend.
    Amen veAmen.

  • Anonymous says:

    well done mate for trying to bring some sanity and perspective to this insane situation.All i can offer is that were everyone involved acting with sincerity without any personal advantage to be gained (and I refer to those on both sides of this ugly argument) I have no doubt that things would have been reconciled bderchai sholom.The only ray of light in all this madness is that Moshiach is back on the agenda and even if it is bringing out the wost in some of us its still far better that apathy towards an Inyan that clearly was and still is primary in thr Rebbes agenda for the world Chaim GLICK

  • I was a witness in CH during those heady days between 1992-1994. I saw hordes of yidden run en masse to 770 whenever their ‘Moshiach beepers’ went off. The beep would notify them that the Rebbe would be visible for a few minutes on the makeshift balcony of 770. Dropping everything they were doing , clutching small children, prams and babies, and leaving each other in mid-sentence, the classrooms and businesses would quickly empty out simultaneously. Literally hundreds of people would run down the streets in a frenzied hurry towards 770. To an outsider the atmosphere felt somewhat panicky, as some thought it meant there was another riot happening. The sense of urgency and expressions of joy served as a thin mask hiding the foreboding and desperation underneath.

    Our beloved Rebbe was no longer able to be with us as before, and we felt like small helpless children who had been suddenly abandoned by our father with no explanation. Was this the end of the beginning or the beginning of the end, we all wondered? No one dared utter the unspeakable answer to that question, yet it remained with us like the elephant in the room we all ignored. At that point in Chabad history none of us could have envisioned in our wildest imaginations the situation we would ultimately find ourselves in after Gimel Tamuz.

    While hundreds of yidden packed into 770 and exuberantly chanted
    Yechi when the Rebbe appeared, I cried. The entire scene seemed totally macabre to me. Here was our great powerful Rebbe relegated to invalid status, in pain, and here were hundreds of yidden singing for joy. I could not for the life of me imagine what they were joyful about and to me it seemed cruel to be so insensitive to the Rebbe’s suffering. There were others who held the same point of view, but the masses were like sheep without a shepherd, following each other in their denial, clinging to shared fantasies.

    It is utterly impossible to state unequivocally that the Rebbe approved of the Yechi chant during those days. Firstly, Yechi was the only niggun the crowd chanted, so while the Rebbe’s motioned with his hand, one could not tell if he approved of the Yechi niggun or if he would have been motioning just as much if they had sung any other niggun. Secondly, the medical reports, documented by some of the most prominent doctors in the world who were working in conjunction with the Rebbe’s inner circle of Secretariat and Chassidim, all agreed the Rebbe was probably in such a state medically that would make any interpretation of the Rebbe’s movements dubious at best (accept by a geriatric/stroke medical professional).

  • I was a witness in CH during those heady days between 1992-1994. I saw hordes of yidden run en masse to 770 whenever their ‘Moshiach beepers’ went off. The beep would notify them that the Rebbe would be visible for a few minutes on the makeshift balcony of 770. Dropping everything they were doing , clutching small children, prams and babies, and leaving each other in mid-sentence, the classrooms and businesses would quickly empty out simultaneously. Literally hundreds of people would run down the streets in a frenzied hurry towards 770. To an outsider the atmosphere felt somewhat panicky, as some thought it meant there was another riot happening. The sense of urgency and expressions of joy served as a thin mask hiding the foreboding and desperation underneath.

    Our beloved Rebbe was no longer able to be with us as before, and we felt like small helpless children who had been suddenly abandoned by our father with no explanation. Was this the end of the beginning or the beginning of the end, we all wondered? No one dared utter the unspeakable answer to that question, yet it remained with us like the elephant in the room we all ignored. At that point in Chabad history none of us could have envisioned in our wildest imaginations the situation we would ultimately find ourselves in after Gimel Tamuz.

    While hundreds of yidden packed into 770 and exuberantly chanted
    Yechi when the Rebbe appeared, I cried. The entire scene seemed totally macabre to me. Here was our great powerful Rebbe relegated to invalid status, in pain, and here were hundreds of yidden singing for joy. I could not for the life of me imagine what they were joyful about and to me it seemed cruel to be so insensitive to the Rebbe’s suffering. There were others who held the same point of view, but the masses were like sheep without a shepherd, following each other in their denial, clinging to shared fantasies.

    It is utterly impossible to state unequivocally that the Rebbe approved of the Yechi chant during those days. Firstly, Yechi was the only niggun the crowd chanted, so while the Rebbe’s motioned with his hand, one could not tell if he approved of the Yechi niggun or if he would have been motioning just as much if they had sung any other niggun. Secondly, the medical reports, documented by some of the most prominent doctors in the world who were working in conjunction with the Rebbe’s inner circle of Secretariat and Chassidim, all agreed the Rebbe was probably in such a state medically that would make any interpretation of the Rebbe’s movements dubious at best (except by a geriatric/stroke medical professional).

  • Anonymous says:

    Since when did Moshiach become so scientific? It is a hope that has been and continues to be fundamental in our survival.

    You can’t crush my hope with your scientific babble.

  • Anonymous says:

    Mrs. Silcove, What are you on about? If you remember those years you would remember the brachos the Rebbe gave people with his by nodding or shaking.Including Plus the encouragement of Yechi was done even before the stroke. As you can see on video. Even Wolpo who was discouraged from his book In 1983 from printing His book Yechi Hamelech. Was given the Rebbe’s Haskamoh in 1991. By the way check out his books they have Haskamoh of Gedolim Such as Rabbi Moshe Finstine, Rabbi Yitzchok Wisse head of Eida Hachraidus etc.
    To what you mentioned about the sign. I know for a fact that a sign is more of a declaration that a shule is a yechi Shule.
    Why does Rabbi Groner not take down the sign?! If Yechi can’t be said.
    Is this like a Chazir who shows off his split hooves and says he is kosher and doesn’t chew it’s cud?!
    I think it would be better for his image if he thinks Yechi turns people off to take down Yechi Sign and give permission for yechi to be said!
    At least he could say the Shule doesn’t endorse Yechi just a few extreeme people!
    But when you have a sign in shule people think we are crazy we have a yechi sign but you can’t say Yechi?!
    Mendel Lipskar, Michoel Stern, Yossi Cohen, and others better wake up before it’s too late because pretty soon it will be forbidden to sing or anounce Yechi in Misivta and Yeshivah classrooms. It’s just a matter of time. Once you start compormising and say you can’t say it in Yeshiva or kolel but in mesivta could pretty soon be forbbiden everywhere in 92 Hotham st! As we saw with their kovetz they took it off!
    As the Rebbe told someone in Yechidus Before Moshiach comes the fire will go to the other side not by Eliyahu and the ball where it went to Eliyahu’s side. But davka to the side of kelipa. As Eliyahu said “until when are you going to play two sides of the fence if You are with Hashem stand with us if you are With the Rebbe stand with Yechiniks. Is it emes or not?! Or you could only say it in your house where no one could see you?! What is this teaching our kids we keep kosher at home but not when we go out?!
    Is this going to be another Gush Katif where everyone is silent and let jews get thrown on the street for their beliefs?!
    Wake up Yiden before it’s too late if Ra Bonim could order jews to be kicked out You should stand outside with the jews kicked out. If a prayer for the Hisgalus of the Rebbe can’t be said in A lubavitcher Shule then anyone who is a true Meshiachist should walk out together! Don’t stand on the fence! As the Rebbe said it’s up to you! Don’t loose out on this opportunity! Yechi Adonainu Morainu Verabainu Melech Hamoshiach Leolam Vaed! And don’t you ever forget it!!!

  • Can anyone else make heads or tails of the last comment posted by anonymous? I can’t.

  • Anonymous says:

    Dov

    Yisroel Paltiel, here again. If you are still reading this, I did not make the comments you are responding to. The only comment I made is the one I put my name on. I didn’t intend to be responsible for every “anonymous” comment.

    So you can withdraw all the personal things you said about me.

  • Anonymous says:

    Right to the point Double Helix – spot on!! Good post!

    We all want rational and intelligent discussion on this and all issues within Chabad. This is a fundamental principal in Chabad, use your own intellect. Many respectful debates have taken place in Shule, at farbrengens and other places, I haven’t witnessed may disrespectful discussions.

    The sign in shule is indicative of the position of the Rov and a significant proportion of the shule’s mispallelim.

    The current debate is about “oifen hamiskabel”, and adhering to the expressed psak of the Rov, Rabbi Groner Shlita.

    The psak is not being listened to and those that defy the psak must not do it in our daled amos. We can’t condone anarchy! We are shooting the messenger, not the message!

    Double Helix | 20.02.08 – 10:41 am AussieEcho

    About time the words “oifen hamiskabel were stated. That was undisputedly the Rebbes primary concern at all times. Without that concept, without the ability to adapt to a particular locale everyone would be going one step forward (if they were lucky) and two backwards.

    That’s what’s happening now. Applying the dogma of our Traumatized Trio, when even blind Freddy and the proverbial drovers dog can see the result is that we are being fractured for absolutely no gain.

    Has any of this carrying on, screaming Yechi, playing the man rather than the ball, has one new person been attracted to Chabad/Yeshivah? Even one? Yet people have voted with their feet, some have left, and even if one person has left the Yeshivah, that’s one person too many, a real tragedy.

    Here is a post from one of the Annonymous’s on David’s Blog

    for everyone’s information…. there is publicized psak din put together in 1998(post gimmel tammuz), which states that REBBE is Moshiach and instructs Am Israel to proclaim and publicize it to everyone in this generation. signed by 250+ chabad and non chabad rabbonim, including Rabbi T. Telsner, Rabbi CT. Groner and alike.

    Who wants anarchy? That’s what’s happening. Why can’t we follow the rebbes doctrine namely that people should consult and respect the Rabbonim? So what if Rabbis C T Groner & Telsner signed a document in 1998? Reb Yoel Kahn to whom none of us even reach his ankles in the depth of knowledge and his “ibber gegebenkeit to the Rebbe, changed his view, why can’t the rabbis have a different view or perspective when times/places/people have changed?

    Nishtana Itim? Ever hear of that term?

    Rabbi Y Groner (Snr) and Rabbi Telsner are fully aware of the past, and have no doubt given this matter enormous amount of thought. If they have come up with a psak, it’s incumbent on all of us to follow. If we don’t, over time, major problems will develop as other “activists” will take a lead from this event and create havoc on other fronts, unrelated to the Yechi/Moshiach business.

    And then what?

    I’m not a maivin on Shulchan Oruch, yet the Alter Rebbe clearly has changed his view on certain Inyonim published in the S.O. which are reflected in his siddur, and other seforim, so we see that there is room to change if an author changes his point of view.

    On a final note, the name of the game is to bring Moshiach sooner rather than later.

    As one poster said, (I’m not sure on which blog) the Rebbe would be the least upset person in the world if Moshiach revealed himself and Moshiach was not he.

  • Anonymous says:

    “Anonymous said…
    Australia is not different! For an entire year the Rebbe encouraged yechi after Mincha & mariv! why is australia different?! Only in 770 should my kids be able to say yechi? Because 1 or 2 or even 3 finaly stand up and say enough is enough! Religious Freedom! Yechi should be anounced! This is not a psak it has no halachik source. plus it never says you cant say yechi. If you take it at face value you cant say anything out loud”

    ARE YOU FOR REAL. Religous freedom to scream and chant whatever you like and whenever you like against the clear ruling of the Rabbi. Give me a break. You are in Noddy land.
    Try going to St Pauls and chant something there! The police will arrest you for being disorderly and a a public nuisance.
    If the Rebbe encourouged every Tom, Dick and Harry to Chant Yechi in Shule and disturb other people davenning howcome this bizzare practice was not done then??

  • aleh shel zait says:

    I can trace 4 types of sons here….

    1)THE INNOCENT VICTIMS –
    I suggest a new voluntary security cordon during each tefillah, especially the part when they cry and beseech out for the Geulah to be immediately revealed, amen vamen!

    2)THE EXTREMISTS –
    a) OFFER mandatory ear plugs in order to desencify violent outburst of ranting, raging and unstoppable urges to lift ones hand against fellow Yidden

    b) INSTRUCT the Gabbai to secure 3D glasses each time they enter the shul in order that they avoid at all cost looking directly at “the sign” so in order to minimize further violent outbursts.

    c) and for the extremists who have repeatedly “stolen” the “Yechi Hamelech” weekly sichos from the shul tables and thrown them into the gniza (preventing others from making the choice as grown ups – whether to read or not read), be given blinkers on their 3D sunglasses (given above) in order that they refrain from stealing “hekdish” again!

    OR in extreme cases “shackle them up to their seats” (is that allowed under Jewish law?). As for halachic problem created, the reader should consult their local Chabad Rabbi.

    3) SIDELINERS who don’t know want to hear YECHI being said, but to suggest to bring in the troups!

    – a good set of ear plugs will do the trick (as with solving a host of other problems like “chatter” during and after davening. + a filter to hear the kaddishin of course.

    4)OUR HOLY REBBONIM-
    An actual system that has worked very well in Kiriyat Malachi, Eretz Yisroel.

    a) APPOINT one person to announce the immanent heralding of the Geulah – saying “YECHI…. (3 times only) after each tephilah on Shabbos and on special occasions announce that dancing will be followed.

    b) On Weekdays – instruct the Gabai of each minyan to decide to appoint or not, one individual to announce “YECHI….” or not.

    This may well be the best solution..

    On a serious note, the Beis Hamikdash was destroyed because of sinat himam, and the tikun is AHAVAT HINAM.

  • Anonymous says:

    Dov,

    I hear your Uncle Arel, the official Merkos Shliach to Melbourne is very knowledgeable about Sichos and what not.

    How come he doesn’t jump up and down like your three lost souls, doesn’t shout from the rooftops, doesn’t dance around, doing hakofos? Doesn’t he share their views as to how and what one should do/say in respect to the Yechi. I don’t see any of his protégés hooning around either. I’m sure he/they believe no less in the Rebbe being Moshiach than anyone else at the Yeshivah. Why then is he/are they so passive?

    The three stooges have got it right and Reb Arel the learned one, has it all wrong?

    Could it be that he disagrees with your off the planet mates? [Shock shock] As the representative of Merkos does that imply Merkos officially distances itself from the shenanigans of the Troubled Trio?

  • Anonymous says:

    Aleh Shel Zait,

    I have a possible solution.

    In the union industry we have the policy “last one on – first one off”.

    Why not adopt the same policy here. The Yechiniks were the “last ones on”. Let them go and start a new minyan, a Yechi Minyan. All their supporters can join them in their Exodus.

    I come from London. That is what occured there. The shriekers are very happy, all thirteen of them. No one bothers them. Everyone is happy.

    Now that’s fair. The non-noisy Yechiniks were here first, their claim to stay is infinately stronger.

    You think a minyan would leave?

  • Anonymous says:

    The choice is ours!
    We can be led by crazies like Zelig, Alex and their cronies or we can have a respectful Shule like frum jews have enjoyed through all the generations.

    When the Rebbe was around there was no Yechi’s being screamt so just because the Rebbe is not with us why change. Isn’t the reason we don’t say Hallel on Yom Hatzmut because the Rebbe was against adding ANYTHING to the tefilla!

    People like Motel Greenbaum could use their profession to help some of these Moshiachists!

  • Anonymous says:

    I think the only solution is the Rabonim have to take down the psak and say we made a mistake(yehudah managed to do it and didn’t kill 3 people).
    Especialy since they signed another psak endorsing Yechi.
    If you can’t say yechi in the shule you can’t dance in the shule. Why don’t we just change the name to Beis Hatalmud because that is all you could do learn!
    Rabonim be careful with your words! I was there in 5753 I saw how the Rebbe encouraged Yechi. The Rebbe knew exactly what was going to happen. The place I was standing had a bunch of polisher Chasidim more than even Lubavitcher.
    Who are we going to listen to Yoel Kahn?! He is a maskil. Today he will come up with this pshat tommorow another etc. Plus he was thrown out of 770 for misinterpiting the Rebbe’s words.
    Let us unite and say Yechi Adonainu Morainu Verabainu Melech Hamoshiach Leolam Vaed!
    If it is okay to daven out loud you could say this also out loud it is part of the Tefilah!
    However people still insist on using old amunition.

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    I think the only solution is the Rabonim have to take down the psak and say we made a mistake(yehudah managed to do it and didn’t kill 3 people).

    THIS IS EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE WHAT THE REBBE SAID MANY TIMES! HOW DARE WE TELL THE RABBONIM HOW TO PASKEN AND DICTATE TO THEM TO SAY THEIR PSAK WAS WRONG. THIS IS LIKE SPITTING INTO THE REBBES FACE. THE YECHI GANG ARE GETTING CRAZIER BY THE DAY! AND THEIR CHUTZPAH AGAINST THE REBBES HEAD SHALIACH IS A SCANDAL.

    PUT THEM IN A MENTAL ASYLUM! A MESHUGANA THINKS EVERYONE ELSE IS MESHUGAH!
    GIVE THE SHULE BACK TO THE SILENT MAJORITY!!!!!

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    If it is okay to daven out loud you could say this also out loud it is part of the Tefilah!

    Well my siddur must have a misprint as Kehos has ommitted the most important part of our tefilla!

  • Anonymous says:

    Mrs Silcove.
    some of the things you have written is 100% correct but you lose ANY type of support when you question the Rebbe’s ZTL’s knowledge and understanding of his surrounding over those 2 years! you are a complete Kofer batorah uvemoshe avdoi! Im sorry, you should take it back or go to the tzion and ask for mechilah. SMK

  • Anonymous says:

    SMK it doesnt seem like she belives in much. we all think these people need help but you dont question the rebe

  • Anonymous says:

    “Well my siddur must have a misprint as Kehos has ommitted the most important part of our tefilla!”

    Believe me the Yechi is in your siddur on every page. We just don’t have the zechus to see it yet.

  • Anonymous says:

    You question the Rebbe’s ZTL’s knowledge and understanding of his surrounding over those 2 years! you are a complete Kofer batorah uvemoshe avdoi!
    Why is she a Kofer. She believes same as the doctors did. I don’t agree with Silcove but maybe we should stop being bullies and tolerate views that don’t agree with our own. Through the generations many believed some Tzaddikim were not fully mentally alert till the last minute, so what!
    Why are we so sensitive??

    It’s time to be more tolerant, as long as people don’t try to sell their wares (by screaming their slogan) in our shule.

  • Calling someone a kofer because they have an opinion you don’t agree with is the height of intolerance, ignorance, arrogance, and sinat chinam.

    The mazkiros and the Chassidim who cared for the Rebbe listened to the doctors, so according to you they were also koferim. The Rebbe himself taught all of us to listen to the medical profession so would you call him a kofer?

    The mazkiros along with the doctors testified that there were times when the Rebbe was more lucid than others. Sometimes they felt he gave clear answers with the nod of his head and other times they could not ascertain if he was cognizant at all. This has been well documented. The amazing stories of miracles are true and can be verified, but this does not deny the Rebbe was also very ill.

    There were miracles and bruchas during those days that I witnessed myself but at the same time the Rebbe wasn’t infallible and he did eventually pass away. There are miracles and then there is reality and both exist in the world at the same time.

    The illusion of the Rebbe’s infallibility was perpetuated by certain Rabbis who chose for their own reasons to manipulate the masses into a false sense of security. This led directly to the mass hysteria that fueled the fire of the Yechi mania after Gimel Tamuz.

    As the Rebbe said many time,’I am mere flesh and blood’. The Rebbe was a tzadik and I saw hundreds of miracles and prohecies come from him, but he was still a human being, not a god. Don’t make him into an idol to be worshipped.

  • Anonymous says:

    It won’t be long till the prayer at the end of Ne’ilah goes from being Hashem Hu Ho’elokim to HaRebbi Hu Ho’elokim.

    Crazies overseas are doing it now. Does that mean they are closer connected to the Rebbe than the three local “loving souls”? Or does that mean they are crazier than the local cretins?

    No doubt Dov Werdiger will explain it away by saying those demented individuals “are not crying out to instigate a dispute, they are crying out in the only language they know”.

    The language of the psychos in mental institutions, both here and overseas.

  • Anonymous says:

    it’s interesting to see how people find reasons to question REBBE’s state of mind when it comes to endorsement of “yechi”. however when they are G-d forbid cornered with critically ill child or another family member or some other personal tragedy, they don’t hesitate to run to REBBE for brocha and guidence no questions asked. any piece of REBBE’s advise which ALWAYS proves to be helpful is treated as totally acceptable.

    we have a choice to greet Moshiach b’simcha, singing and dancing, or b’gvurah, cornered in pain and suffering G-d forbid. but we will all face him. it’s up to us to choose how.

    MOSHIACH NOW!

    elka

  • Anonymous says:

    Dear Elka

    Prepare to meet Moshiach any way you wish to, but don’t invade my space.

    In other words, keep out of my face!

    Moshiach Now! has just become another slogan, like G’day mate. Have these slogans brought anyone closer to Moshiach?

    G’ay Mate most probably is a friendlier gesture and more meaningful, but you wouldn’t understand, would you?

    G’DAY MATE!

  • During those days (’92-’94) Rabbi Majesky held a weekly shiur for married women in the basement of Machon Chana. A woman came to the shiur one day crying. She had called the hotline which gave daily reports of the Rebbe’s medical condition, and the report made her upset as it was very ominous.

    I distinctly remember Rabbi Majesky telling all of us that crying over the Rebbe’s illness indicated a lack of faith. He told us that the Rebbe was not actually ill, that it only seemed that he was ill to our mere physical eyes, but in reality, as Rabbi Majesky taught, the Rebbe was transforming his neshoma into that of Moshiach and that spiritual transformation appeared to us as an illness. He went on to say that if we looked with spiritual eyes we would understand and that anyone who believed the Rebbe was ill was not a real chosid.

    At that point I stopped heeding those irrational Rabbis and clung to the sane ones.

  • Anonymous says:

    this is absurd, i am no messiachist but anyone standard but people like you make me want to shout out yechi! our rebbe was the greatest leader, the Rebbe is for sure moshiach but we dont need to shout it out. very few chassdim will deny it for Rabbi Kahn in NY to the most extreme “left”. many of you have missed the boat, chassidim are discussing how and whre but NOT IF!

  • Again, another incomprehensible post from an anonymous poster.
    Before you write and post, please,take a deep breathe, think hard, then write out what you want to say slowly, then check it over, read it outloud, use spell check and grammar check, and after all that then post it. This way perhaps someone can figure out what on earth you are trying to say.

  • Anonymous says:

    When we women dress as Chassidim of the Rebbe rather than try to look like a shiksa with tzenios tossed out the window we will be taken more seriously when we daven for Moshiach. It is pathetic to what low levels some of us will stoop to imitate the Goyim.

    We need to deserve Moshiach rather than barrack for Moshiach with all the gimicks as if it is a football team.

  • Anonymous says:

    We need to deserve Moshiach rather than barrack for Moshiach with all the gimicks as if it is a football team.
    But this is the American way. Banners, slogans, badges etc. etc. Brain washing, Marketing, Propoganda and Character assasination has become a culture in Chabad since Gimmel Tamuz.

    I never saw the Rebbe wear a Moshiach pin on his lapel or Hat!
    How long do we still need to be the laughing stock of the entire community?

  • Anonymous says:

    4 options:
    1. what they did now they so called forbid recital of Yechi out loud in shule. But kept the yechi sign on.
    2. Take the Yechi sign down and let people who choose to anounce Yechi anounce it and those who don’t want to hear it could leave or be silent.
    3. Take Yechi Sign down and not let anyone say Yechi
    4. Keep Yechi sign and Rabonim take down their letter against Yechi.
    Option 2 would reap benifits for Rabbi Groner that he could tell any member, supporter etc. that the mosad doesn’t endorse Yechi but if an individual decides to anounce Yechi it’s his own opinion nothing to do with the mosad’s opinion.
    But when You have 1. a massive Yechi sign and then a person reads a notice don’t read what it says on the sign inside the shule.
    People wonder why you have a Yechi sign in the first place if you can’t even read the words that are written on the sign?!

  • Anonymous says:

    wow david you really have let loose the lunatics that last one about the non tznius shikseh dressing i think that guy or woman needs an extreme makeover mentally and most likely phisically as well you really are bringing them out of the woodwork and while we are on the topic cant those crazy meshicistim do something to make my footy team win a game this year

  • I am astounded at the poor quality of most of the posts about a serious topic. They appear to be posted by either or the very young, the illiterate, the uneducated, the shallow, or the just plain lazy. How pathetic. I wonder why they would bother if they can’t even take the time or make the effort to write something vaguely worth taking the time to read.

  • Anonymous says:

    Mrs. Silcove: I have read all of your posts and the common denominator between them all is a pure intolerance for anyone who doesn’t agree with you. I realise that you have used that argument against anyone who dared raise their voice against some of your totally nonsensical and irrational remarks. Nevertheless, I do believe that your comments display total and utter intolerance of opposing ideas. When someone lashes out at you, you just retort with a comment on the bad English. Don’t worry, I’m sure you found mistakes in my comment. But let me reassure you, I spent a few minutes and counted over thirty spelling and grammatical errors in just a fraction of your posts.
    I think you should step down from the high platform to where you wrongly stepped up.
    Just like a mishichist has to understand that there are great Chabad Rabbis who have opposing views, the non-mishichistim have to understand that, likewise, there are great Chabad Rabbis who are mishichistim. Why when a Rabbi is a mishichist he is dismissed as crazy or “lost the plot after gimmel tammuz”, but if a Rabbi is a fervent opposer of the movement, he is termed “normal”?
    Doesn’t this undermine the whole idea of Rabbonim. WE, AS PEOPLE LISTEN TO RABBONIM. If Rabbis have a dispute, that doesn’t make either of them bad. It is funny to see how many of the apparently “big mishichist” Rabbis are on excellent terms with “big anti’mishichist” Rabbis.
    Why do people have to butt into every single controversial topic, while in their every day avodah they are totally lost.
    You said you lost taste for Rabbis like Rabbi Majeski when he said something “fanatical”. It is funny you didn’t find the courage to confront or question him. Instead you were satisfied to delete him from your list of Rabbis and you entitled yourself to reject anything he says.
    How low and childish is that?
    Someone called you a kofer in an above post. Though I try to refrain from using descriptions like that, I must say that some of your comments are way off target. There are some things which must remain non-negotiable.
    Before yud shvat, someone came to the Rebbe (while he was still the sob-in-law of the then Rebbe) and said that he heard from somebody that the Friediker Rebbe is suddenly hooked onto his moshiach campaign (laleter letshuvah lealter legaulah) because he has suffered alot and being that his physical and mental state had largely declined over the years in Russia, he was coming up with this scapegoat called Moshiach.
    the Rebbe’s response was brief and sharp. “Someone who says something of that sort can never be trusted on Jewish matters….”

    There is a not so esteemed Rabbi in Melbourne who claimed that our Rebbe’s fanaticism in Moshiach was triggered by the Rebbetzin’s passing because of a so-called depression… Based on teh above story I question this rabbis validity and, quite frankly, your’s too.

    I like tolerance and free expression, but you cannot claim to have a belief system and then contradict some of its basic premises. No, the Rebbe is not G-d, but G-dliness speaks through him and YES, G-DLINESS DOESN’T ERR.
    Just like Moshe, Dovid, and all our Moshe’s of every generation…

    My suggestion to you, is to go apologise to teh Rebbe’s Head Shliach, Rabbi Groner and as shlucho shel odom kemoso, he may be able to give you a tikkun…
    Until then, please stop spewing your hate!

  • Anonymous says:

    to “g’day mate” anonymous, i don’t know how much space you take up, so not sure how much of it i’m invading. neither do i know our face, is it the one beaming with love for a fellow jew?
    on a more serious note, it is not up to us to measure how close Moshiach is from revealing himself. “Moshiach Now!”is very relevent and meaningful to those who say it. it is said in line with REBBE’s instuctions to bring awareness to this world about imminent revelation of Moshiach. when someone hears the words the subject is brought to their attention. it’s up to them what they do with it. i think chaim glick mentioned it before, one way or another people become more aware of our fundemental belief/goal.

    Moshiach Now!

    elka

  • Anonymous says:

    Go shoshana go to adas they will love you there

  • Anonymous says:

    Hear, Hear.
    Well done, whoever that was.

    Enough aimless contradiction, we all have our mostly valid opinions, and this isn’t the time or place to vent.

    Let the constuctive conversation begin.

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    Go shoshana go to adas they will love you there

    I think the people in adas with their ahavat Yisrael and the code of dress that their women adhere to, will bring Moshiach quicker than the likes of Chaim Glick etc.

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka,

    You have too much time on your hands.

    You sound like a born again Christian flogging eternal love & salvation if the right words are mouthed.

    Get a life, pe-lee-eease!

    (different Annonymous)

  • Anonymous says:

    wonder what shoshana thinks about those shikseh like non tznius women bringing down the standards in our community shame on you girls dont you know you are stopping moshiach how can he come to a place where the women are not tznius the more i think about it the more im connvinced that miss taliban silkov and her cronies would do well on oak grove

  • Mrs. Silcove: I have read all of your posts and the common denominator between them all is a pure intolerance for anyone who doesn’t agree with you. I realise that you have used that argument against anyone who dared raise their voice against some of your totally nonsensical and irrational remarks. Nevertheless, I do believe that your comments display total and utter intolerance of opposing ideas. When someone lashes out at you, you just retort with a comment on the bad English.

    Shoshanna write, Firstly, it is clear to me you are a male because you address me as Mrs. Silcove and I assume that this is for tznius reasons. Secondly, you may be male, but you lack the manhood to sign your name. Many of the posts are not merely in bad English but, they are completely and totally incomprehensible to anyone but the poster. I didn’t even realise the post was lashing out at me, as you say, cause I could not understand what was written at all.

    Don’t worry, I’m sure you found mistakes in my comment. But let me reassure you, I spent a few minutes and counted over thirty spelling and grammatical errors in just a fraction of your posts.

    Shoshanna writes, If you found 30 mistakes then please, enlighten me, as I am always willing to learn how to improve my writing.

    I think you should step down from the high platform to where you wrongly stepped up.

    SHhoshanna writes, It is very easy to insult me while you remain anonymous. Shows you lack integrity and guts, whoever you may be. You’re correct, I am intolerant of certain things, but not of people with differing opinions, but of silly anonymous posters like you who insult people anonymously and are incapable of adding anything of real merit to a serious discussion.

    Just like a mishichist has to understand that there are great Chabad Rabbis who have opposing views, the non-mishichistim have to understand that, likewise, there are great Chabad Rabbis who are mishichistim.

    Shoshanna writes, I don’t actually think we have any real great Chabad Rabbis left at all, just a bunch of mediocre ones. The great ones are from generations past. But for argument’s sake, I’ll agree there are well meaning and smart people on both sides and for the record, I have never intimated otherwise.

    Why when a Rabbi is a mishichist he is dismissed as crazy or “lost the plot after gimmel tammuz”, but if a Rabbi is a fervent opposer of the movement, he is termed “normal”?

    Shoshanna wrties, I have never labelled all Meshichists Rabbis as crazy. Some are very crazy, and those are the dangerous influential ones, but most are simply convinced by their own biases that they are correct. I feel some of them are emotionally blinded and confused. So sue me for thinking that, but I do.

    Doesn’t this undermine the whole idea of Rabbonim. WE, AS PEOPLE LISTEN TO RABBONIM. If Rabbis have a dispute, that doesn’t make either of them bad.

    Shoshanna wrties, We do not follow Rabbonim blindly. The Rebbe made that clear, that we should think for ourselves and always question Rabbonim. Some Rabbonim in my view are fantastic guys, but some are bad guys. I am entitled to pick and choose among them. I am entitled to have my own judgments about people. What is your problem with that? And some Rabbonim make serious mistakes that hurt a lot of people.

    It is funny to see how many of the apparently “big mishichist” Rabbis are on excellent terms with “big anti’mishichist” Rabbis.
    Why do people have to butt into every single controversial topic, while in their every day avodah they are totally lost.
    You said you lost taste for Rabbis like Rabbi Majeski when he said something “fanatical”. It is funny you didn’t find the courage to confront or question him. Instead you were satisfied to delete him from your list of Rabbis and you entitled yourself to reject anything he says.

    Shoshanna wrties, How do you have the chutzpah to accuse me of not having the guts to confront him? You are the coward as shown by your anonymity. Moreover, you would not know what occurred between me and Rabbi Majesky or anyone else, so how can you make up things? Are you over the age of 25, cause if you are I feel sorry for you, cause you seem very immature.

    How low and childish is that?
    Someone called you a kofer in an above post. Though I try to refrain from using descriptions like that, I must say that some of your comments are way off target.

    There are some things which must remain non-negotiable.
    Before yud shvat, someone came to the Rebbe (while he was still the sob-in-law of the then Rebbe) and said that he heard from somebody that the Friediker Rebbe is suddenly hooked onto his moshiach campaign (laleter letshuvah lealter legaulah) because he has suffered alot and being that his physical and mental state had largely declined over the years in Russia, he was coming up with this scapegoat called Moshiach.
    the Rebbe’s response was brief and sharp. “Someone who says something of that sort can never be trusted on Jewish matters….”

    Shoshanna wrties, I cannot even begin to explain to you how off you are. Since when is it kofer to say that we are not certain the Rebbe is Moshiach? Are you an ignoramus or are you deluded or both? Are you calling all the Rabbonim who hold the same as I do koferim?

    There is a not so esteemed Rabbi in Melbourne who claimed that our Rebbe’s fanaticism in Moshiach was triggered by the Rebbetzin’s passing because of a so-called depression… Based on the above story I question this rabbis validity and, quite frankly, your’s too.

    I like tolerance and free expression, but you cannot claim to have a belief system and then contradict some of its basic premises. No, the Rebbe is not G-d, but G-dliness speaks through him and YES, G-DLINESS DOESN’T ERR.
    Just like Moshe, Dovid, and all our Moshe’s of every generation…

    My suggestion to you, is to go apologise to teh Rebbe’s Head Shliach, Rabbi Groner and as shlucho shel odom kemoso, he may be able to give you a tikkun…
    Until then, please stop spewing your hate!

    Shoshanna wrties, You should move to Cuba since you would love Communism. One does not have to apologise for having an opinion in Torah that differs from a particular Rabbi? And you are a classic example of someone who accuses others of what you are guilty of—you are the one who is spewing hatred, whoever you are Mr. Nobody.

  • Anonymous says:

    Who are Silcoves Talaban cronies??

    MOSHIACH NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Some of you may remember the Yud Tes Kislev the Rebbe was ill. F0r almost an hour or more the Rebbe tried in vain to communicate something snd no one, not the entire Anash, not any Rabbonim including the mazkiros, absolutely not a single yid in the entire packed 770 could figure out what he wanted to say. And it pained us all because the Rebbe was clearly frustrated about it.

    This event was one public example that there were times when the Rebbe’s illness prevented him from communicating. There were many private examples of this as well, contrary to the Meshichists’s assertion that the Rebbe was in charge all the time. He was a tzadik but still human.

  • Anonymous says:

    Hmmmm.

    I can see why DaMinyan is so attractive to the youth.

    They have voted with their feet, given the flick to all the mentals, they have no interest in the Yechi saga and most of them I imagine couldn’t care less if the rebbe is moshiach or not. When the real moshiach reveals himself and it’s someone else, they’ll accept him with open arms as will the rebbe. And if it turns out to be the rebbe, everyone else will accept him with open arms. It’s a win-win situation. Just get on an do what the rebbe said will hasten the bringing of moshiach. Convincing people that moshiach is the rebbe, would have to rank at the very bottom of the list if at all. What a waste of time, what an absolute waste of time and energy.

  • The previous comment is very wise indeed!

  • Anonymous says:

    Well most adas women dress as the Rebbetzen Chaya Moushka did. So probaly the Rebbetzen is between the TALABAN CRONIES!

    I believe we should shoot all those women in Oak Grove who dare not to follow the latest crazy fashions from the perverts in Paris and Italy! Then we would have no more Talaban and we could all scream 24 hours a day YECHI at the top of our voices, and dance all day.

  • Anonymous says:

    what does it mean to the previous writer when the rebbe by a farbrengen removed his mothers name from a girls mossad in president street because upon his annual visit there on pesach he noticed there were no mirrors in the dormitory im not suggesting that the paris fashion houses are the avenue for dirah betachtonim but clearly a disregard of fashion by girls is not desirable in any event is this what we have become lets get a grip .girls and women need to present themselves in a respectable clean and maybe even modern fashion hope you dont send osama on me for that last comment but this is not about women or their choice of clothing its about the hatred that spews forth from those who feel disenfranchised for whatever reason all i can say is where is the love

  • Anonymous says:

    I HAVE JUST READ ALL THE COMMENTS POSTED HERE BY ALL INVOLVED i THINK I WAS QUITE INNOCENT IN MY COMMENTS AND DON’T FEEL THAT IT WAS FAIR TO USE ME IN CONTRAST TO THOSE IN ADAS CONCERNING THE COMING OF MOSHIACH BIMHAROH BEYOMAYNU. IN ANY EVENT ANNONOMOUS POSTINGS ARE PASHKVILIM AND WE ALL KNOW HOW MUCH WEIGHT THEY BARE PLEASE WHOEVER YOU ARE AGAIN PLEASE REFRAIN FROM MENTIONING ME AGAIN IN YOUR NASTY TIRADE I MEANT NO OFFENCE BY MY ORIGINAL COMMENTS AND I WOULD APPRECIATE IT IF YOU LEAVE ME OUT OF ALL THIS I WAS NOT AND STILL AM NOT INVOLVED HAVE A GOOD SHABBOS MATE CHAIM GLICK

  • The Rebbe did not take his name off of Machon Chana because of the lack of mirrors. I heard this story at least 100 times when I studied there. The story you wrote above is completely wrong. The Rebbe took his name off of Machon Chana because he felt they were not folllowing the proper derech al pi Chassidus at the time.

    The story about the mirrors goes like this; one year (when? ’70’s?)the Rebbe came to examine the dorm as he did each Pesach. After looking at each corner of each room he complimentied Mrs. Gansbourg the dorm matron for making it into a ‘palace’. The Rebbe also suggested they put up mirrors because the girls should be able to see if they are dressed properly and that they should know what is going on in the outside world so they should have radios too.

    Tznios does not mean we have to be dowdy, but tznios also does not mean we should be trendy either.

  • Anonymous says:

    I object for anyone to suggest the Rebbe would remove his mothers name due to not having mirrors. It would be easier to bur mirrors than to change a name!

    Maybe it was due to the fact that the girls were not chanting and screaming Yechi or that there were no yellow flags?

  • Anonymous says:

    lets leave the level of trendy v dowdy(WHATEVER THAT MEANS) TO EITHER THE WOMEN GIRLS THEIR HUSBANDS OR MASHPIM I DONT THINK ITS A MATTER OF CONCERN TO THIS ARGUMENT

  • Anonymous says:

    to i object try english we may understand you then

  • admin says:

    I have removed a couple of comments that were disgusting, personal, and inflammatory.

    Folks, please can we show some respect for others? Don’t say anything here that you would not say to someone’s face!

  • Anonymous says:

    Dear Shoshana,

    Please stop fooling yourself, you don’t know everything.
    Time to move on and get a life and perhaps do something productive with all your wonderful talents you say you have.

    (and no, I refuse to write my name so that you wont abuse me like all the other people you have abused)

    Nothing personal, but it seems that over time you’ve lost the plot.

  • As Chaim Glick wrote, anonymous postings are pashkivilin, and they have no validity as they are the mere scribbles of frightened shadows.

  • Anonymous says:

    To Mrs. Silcove:
    I understand your anger with my previous posting. In fact, I expected it. The only reason I left it anonymous is because I am afraid that people reading my post decide that I feel a certain way and will then place me on one side of the fence. Even though I may argue for one side I refuse to identify, unequivocally with one.

    I see from your response (as I have seen from your previous postings) that you are no stupid woman. You dissect issues very nicely. Before I begin, allow me to preface with a request that none of this turn into a tit-for-tat game, where I curse you and then you curse me back. I want to discuss this with you, but as you yourself said, this must be a meaningful discussion.

    1. If you are open-minded as you claim to be, then why in the world do you have a problem with the yechi sign in shule. Rabbi Cohen wrote in his letter that, although he doesn’t necessarily agree with the concept, the feeling of many to constantly say yechi can still be understood. If he can accept that fact despite his well-known distancing from all mishichist things, then surely you could accept a sign that, as I’m sure you agree is not against shulchan aruch, but just not consistent with all YOUR views.

    2. When I attacked your questioning of the Rebbe’s wholesome truth, I did not refer to his status as Moshiach, but whether he can make mistakes or not. It is clear from many sichos, letters and stories that so long as a Rebbe allows himself to be seen by us, he want us to see and learn from his every action. Like the Hayom Yom which says that every move of a tzadik is precise and must teach in avodas hashem. If the Rebbe didn’t want us to see his actions because they were “impaired” (R”L) he would have made sure not to mislead us by not being visible to us then.
    You clearly think otherwise, as you wrote:
    start quote “It is utterly impossible to state unequivocally that the Rebbe approved of the Yechi chant during those days. Firstly, Yechi was the only niggun the crowd chanted, so while the Rebbe’s motioned with his hand, one could not tell if he approved of the Yechi niggun or if he would have been motioning just as much if they had sung any other niggun. Secondly, the medical reports, documented by some of the most prominent doctors in the world who were working in conjunction with the Rebbe’s inner circle of Secretariat and Chassidim, all agreed the Rebbe was probably in such a state medically that would make any interpretation of the Rebbe’s movements dubious at best (except by a geriatric/stroke medical professional).” end quote…

    I still won’t call you a kofer, but I do think you nee to speak to your mashpiim about your beliefs in a Rebbe.

    3. Yes, Rabbis can make mistakes, but we cannot afford to dismiss them as political and frauds. You think in Russia and Poland they had none of these politics. Not too long ago REBBES were “fighting” (for lack of a better word). A Rabbis failure to stand up against something negative, although terrible, does not disqualify his shitos and interpretations as a scholar.

    4. Can I be so rude as to ask you a personal question? I am curious as to whether you have people in this world to who you look for guidance.
    All of the rest of the writers here, or at least most of them, don’t seem to be so courageous in their war because as sure as they are, they know there’s another side. Additionally they don’t like to insult people just because they don’t agree with them.
    Many of your shitos are contrary to my interpretations of the Rebbe’s teachings, but I don’t call you all time of names.
    When I said you should apologise to Rabbi Groner, I didn’t mean that you should agree to how I or he think, but you should cease cursing opinions of people who were much closer to teh Rebbe than you and I. And yes, Rabbi Krinsky was even closer to the Rebbe, but there are many Rabbis in Chabad who enjoyed much attention from the Rebbe who all have different shitos in this story…

    5. The only time I have a right to totally disqualify you is if you are speaking in the framework of the Rebbe’s teachings and you nevertheless GO AGAINST, basic rules of the Rebbes teachings. Rabbi Cohen accepts in his letter that Chassidim have always believed that their Rebbe was Moshiach. And even after his passing, based on the REBBE’S OWN SICHOS about the Previous Rebbe, it is fair to say with certainty (like Chassidim did back then) that the Rebbe is Moshiach.

    I am a bit tire, so I hope this response was satisfactory, even though the thoughts are a bit mixed up…

    Just be fair in all your comments. That’s all I ask from you.
    p.s. you are correct in your assumption that I am male, and you nee not feel bad for me as I am younger than 25!

  • Anonymous says:

    Chaim Glick, please do NOT make yourself innocent, as you are NOT. you are involved in this as you have pout yourself involved. if you cant take DONT givE. i dont know if your farbragens on shabbos morning is helping bringing moshiach either, whoever that is.

  • To Anonymous who asked me all those questions (and is under 25 years old), forgive me but I have no more time to spend on this for now. Suffice to say that not only do I indeed have guidance from Rabbis but I am close to some of the Rebbe’s closest Chassidim and some of the most fantastic people in Lubavitch. It is obvious you live in a very small world and have not experienced much of the Lubavitch world outside your small circle or else you would know that there are hundreds of respected upstanding Chassidim who agree with the point of view I espouse. You would have heard of most of their names. You are young still and easily impressionable and I do not have time to give you the full education required to make you understand my viewpoint. Gut Shabbos

  • Anonymous says:

    i like mrs silcove have nothing left to say especialy to pashkvil writing cowards .I never really had an opinion to begin with ,IN ANY EVENT REFUAH SHELAMO AND A GOOD SHABBOS WHOEVER YOU ARE

  • Anonymous says:

    This is all becoming boring!

    Why don’t we have a competition this Shabbos. Whoever can scream Yechi louder in middle of the Shmonei Asrei will win Zeligs famous yellow t-shirt.

    The judges can be Chaim Glick, Shlomo Werdiger and Shoshana Silcove.

  • Anonymous says:

    This competition is not fair. The T Shirt wouldn’t fit some (eg. Chaim Tzvi)!

  • Anonymous says:

    My last word before Shabbos. People have to listen to the rabbonim Al Asar. Those who can’t or won’t, have an option. Leave! I will explain at tomorrows kiddush.CHAIM GLICK

  • Anonymous says:

    Wow!

    Talk about Loshon Horah.

  • I spend a considerable amoount of time and effort with some of my posts. I feel I often write serious cogent essays regarding important weighty topics facing the Chabad world, things I care deeply about. In return I have often received hateful invective from anonymous and sometimes known individuals who heap scorn upon me for having an outpsoken opinion. Although my opinions are often well thought out and researched, I never assume I am always correct and welcome vigorous debate of my assertions. I debate fairly. I am honest. And yet often I have been treated with utmost disdain for it, with people sometimes attackng me in person, talking behind my back etc. Of course, it hurts my feelings sometimes as I am not made of stone and there are times I want to give it back but, I know it is wrong to do so, so I try to remain dignified, but it is not easy to do when one is trying to have a mature debate and that debate is degraded by mean spirited people.

    I have concluded that perhaps we are not ready for intelligent debate at all, especially from a thinking woman. I find it frustrating that when I relate some of my experiences people invalidate them as if I am making things up. This makes me frustrated

    If I have ever hurt anyone’s feelings during any of my positngs I apologise. I really would love that we could have a deep meaningful open intelligent debate sometime…with whomever..and that we, I, could actually be respected and heard and that we could respect each other for once. At the same time I won’t allow myself to be manipulated or belittled.

  • My university education did not prepare me for the intense dogma I see in the Chabad community where honest, fair, and open debate is stifled and often acrimonous. I don’t think that university is very positive for Jews for many reasons, but a useful thing they taught me was how to write and argue a point of view somewhat coherently and resaonably without resorting to personal attacks and immature ramblings. This is obviously an area in which the community can improve. And although I am not a feminist by any means, I do believe a certain degree of sexism is at play when a woman tries to intelligently offer her educated opinion and her experiences. The men seem to listen alot less than in the world I lived in previously, although this is a better world for me in other aspects, in this area of public debate I feel a woman is considered to be second class as her voice is not taken serioulsy, epsecially by Rabbinic leaders. Don’t all attack me now, just my humble opinion.

  • Anonymous says:

    david p;eases close this down some geniass wrote something and put my my name to it i never wrote anything about explaining something at the farbrengen tomorow who am i to take center stage and explain policy i didnt write that and its all too easy for anybody to write what they like with someones name David close this down if you can the real chaim glick

  • Anonymous says:

    “Anonymous said…
    This is all becoming boring!
    Why don’t we have a competition this Shabbos. Whoever can scream Yechi louder in middle of the Shmonei Asrei will win Zeligs famous yellow t-shirt.
    “The judges can be Chaim Glick, Shlomo Werdiger and Shoshana Silcove.”
    A N O T H E R P O S T
    “22 February, 2008
    Anonymous said…
    This competition is not fair. The T Shirt wouldn’t fit some (eg. Chaim Tzvi)!”

    Well Zelig has comfirmed that his famous Yellow Moshiach T-Shirt is in fact much bigger than we think it is. … We with our worldly eyes are not in a madrega to see the full large T-Shirt, but it is definetly there.
    So B”H Chaim Tzvi can also enter the competition!

  • Anonymous says:

    Two Chaim Glicks? No way. Come on Chaim you take center stage every week. Why get cold feet now?

  • Anonymous says:

    It’s pitifull that so much energy, knowledge, passion is put on this factor Ychie…
    The silent majority of the shul probably agrees with the Yechiniks.To push them away will only creat division in the community.
    Dov Werdiger comments was so far the most sensible one .
    Why this crying from the soul, bother someone?????
    Because inside themselves (the mitnagdim) they lost the naivity and purety which this young people cry out loud for heavens to hear.

    But the conservatives are the one with the mulaHHH, or the machinery oil of the shul. In other words, without their money, the shul probably wouldn’t be there.

    We have to remember that Yeshiva, have all the denomination in the spectrum of Judaism.
    Conservative, Chabad, Chozrei be Tshuva Kipa Sruga, Sephardim…..all feel that they have a house, where they can look for spiritual fulfilment.

    One have to look at the mitnagdim themselves, and decided, are they correct?????
    The head of Yshiva forbade the Meshianiks to call Yechi.
    But also forbade people doing small talk during the services.
    Does any one listen. No !!!!!!

    I just feel pity for the community, which instead of coming to shul to pray and elevate one soul, they come to bicker and use their egos to acertain their position of power.

    In the mean time, people like my self have been attacked on Carlisle St with my son, and nobody….. nobody from the head of communities came to our help, in order to prevent another attack or do something about it…..

    While you are bickering about the messianik…. i am attacked because i walk with a chabanik, which happens to be my son.

    This is a more serious matter and you are bickering about our own people , which have more effervecent faith than your own……

    Why not used the same people to do the rounds at night to protect your sons or my son…… Use them in a positive way…..

    Give them some credit ..
    Keep Judaism effervescent young and full of hope, not a faith that smells of mothballs

    it may appear as anonymous, like you Paltiel i don’t know how to use the google thing…..

    Ester Weiss

  • Anonymous says:

    al tarbeh sicha im isho all annon writers are cearly women cause they dont have balls therefor we should refrain from responding to them

  • Anonymous says:

    YECHI Mr & Mrs Chaim Glick Laolam Voad!

  • Anonymous says:

    Why in this so called psak the rabonim left there was no refrences? Why didn’t they put up a “psak” not to use violence? Why is Rabbi Groner not standing up to the proclamation of Yechi?! But he stood up to the Yechi Sign?! Why did it not mention Yechi in the “psak”? Or in his speach on Shabbos which Incited violence? If Everyone follows these rabonim so blindly what do we need A Rebbe? Rabbi Groner could be the new Melbourne Rebbe!

  • Anonymous says:

    If the Rebbe will decline to become Moshiach we could nominate Groner as Moshiach. I can picture him in an open limo next to Helen Shardey (same as on Lag Bomer)!

  • Anonymous says:

    Good idea Esther.

    We’ll call ourselves the Annonymous Vigilantes.

    Chief Operations Officer – Dov Werdiger

    Town Crier – Zelig Whatshisface

    Official Representing Alfred Psyche Ward – Alex Doughnut

    Specialist Liason Officer – Morry Siroolnik (no one will understand him)

    For identification purposes, I will wear a Bhurka with dark sunglasses.

    My code name Vigi-1

  • Anonymous says:

    I think CHAIM GLICK would be more popular to become Moshiach, especially by the young women!

  • yechi chaim glick says:

    Question for the feral Meshichists.
    Had the rebbetzen outlived the rebbe, would she be able to remarry?
    Or would she syill be an eishes ish?

  • Anonymous says:

    Message From Nutchi Glick!

    If our esteemed brother Reb Chaim Glick gets the endorsement to become Moshiach we offer free doughnuts to all!

  • Anonymous says:

    ZAVDIEL’S PIZZA & FELAFEL…..

    In the merit of the tremendous outcry for the immanent revelation of MOSHIACH we are offering:

    3 GREAT GEULA PIZZA SPECIALS*

    1) FREE 1.25L DRINK with any 2 Family Pizza’s ordered

    2) FREE FAMILY CHIPS with any 3 Family Chips ordered

    3) FREE SMALL CHIPS for all kids under 13 with any meal ordered
    (just say the 12 pesukim and YECHI 3 times)

    * Just mention this BLOG
    * Available MON-FRI until Beis Nissan (to be explained soon) this year.

    Shabbat Shalom
    The team at ZAVDIEL’S

  • Anonymous says:

    yechi chaim glick said…
    “Question for the feral Meshichists.
    Had the rebbetzen outlived the rebbe, would she be able to remarry?
    Or would she syill be an eishes ish?”

    See Shulchan Oroch – Hilchos Eishes Moshiach, for the answer. It depends on numerous factors!

  • Anonymous says:

    ZAVDIEL’S PIZZA & FELAFEL

    oops

    Special No. 2

    FREE FAMILY CHIPS with any 3 Family Pizza’s ordered

  • Anonymous says:

    Just a question about the Psak if someone could elaborate:

    There is a sign in Shul which translates as:

    IT IS FORBIDDEN TO TALK DURING TEPHILA AND READING OF THE TORAH

    There is also a sign which translates as:

    LONG LIVE OUR MASTER TEACHER REBBE KING MOSHIACH FOR EVER & EVER

    If this sign is refering to the Lubavicher Rebbe, why are people so distrepectful to our Rabbonim, their Psak and the Rebbe for failing to follow the first sign and then interupt people reading the second?

    I sincerely hope our Rabbonim admonish these radical elements causing so much distress, so we can just daven without all the background “business talk” DURING Tephila.

    A concerned mispallelim

  • Anonymous says:

    Based on this blog looks like there are many mesechist in the comminuty!!! Thanks for your support!!

  • Anonymous says:

    “Anonymous said…
    Based on this blog looks like there are many mesechist in the comminuty!!! Thanks for your support!!”

    No need to thank them, it’s not their fault that they were born a little looney (some very looney!)

  • Anonymous says:

    I heard all about this blog on Shabbat at Shule.
    The question many asked when Moshiach arrives at it happens not to be the Rebbi of Chabad (as no one knows the identity of Moshiach according to the Rambam and all other sources) how will Moshiach feel towards all those that have been sp[reading all the propoganda that the Rebbi is Moshiach?

    Would love an answer.
    Avi

  • Anonymous says:

    I heard all about this blog on Shabbat at Shule.

    The question many asked, when Moshiach arrives and it happens not to be the Rebbi of Chabad (as no one knows the identity of Moshiach according to the Rambam and all other sources!) how will Moshiach feel towards all those that have been spreading all the propoganda that the Rebbi is Moshiach?

    Would love an answer.
    Avi

  • Anonymous says:

    Annon wrote: “If this sign is refering to the Lubavicher Rebbe, why are people so distrepectful to … interupt people reading the sign?”

    You guys are just brilliant at distortion! Nobody has ever interuppted anyone for reading the Yechi sign. So please don’t distort the facts. Here we are talking about those clowns who yell and scream Yechi disturbing the majority and making our Shule into a circus. The same would be said if these crazies keep screaming the time from the clock, or yell out the words from any other sign. The vast majority would like that our shule should be like all other shules (It is a pleasure to daven at 770!) and stick to the way our shule has been for over 50 years. Let the crazies make their own shule.
    Let’s try to stick to the facts as we already have too much fantasy.
    Every individual who breaks the Psak is spitting in the Rebbe’s face!

  • Anonymous says:

    dear Avi,

    1. the REBBE told us about the identity of Moshiach with the reference to RAMBAM….

    you should read the copy of psak din sighed by r. Telsner in 1998…
    http://www.psakdin.net/en/

    2.for the sake of the argument, if like you said Hashem will choose another, he should have no problems with those who believe that the REBBE is Moshiach, because a. Moshiach’s role does not involve to be intimidated by what others think or do. Moshe was not welcomed, nor supported by many, yet he did his job as a leader. b. Moshiach who will know that these people acted purely because of their genuine belief in the prophet of our generation, who consistently instructed them to publicize the imminent revelation of Moshiach should not have any problems with that.

    MOSHIACH NOW!!!

    elka

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka you are wrong!
    The Rebbe is Moshiach period. He told us so. If Hashem tries to choose someone else I guarantee we will still stick with the Rebbe. He will always be OUR moshiach.

    If they want to have 2 Moshiachs so be it. We will never abandon MHM.

    YECHI ADONENU MOIRENU VRANEINU MELECH HAMOSHIACH LEOLAM VOAD!

  • kreplach says:

    Anything exciting happen in the Yeshiva this Shabbos?

  • Anonymous says:

    i did say “for argument’s sake”… in my view every person has a freedom of choice. so does this avi person and he has to have an opportunity to come up with his own conclusion. in order to believe in what the REBBE says, one needs to know what the REBBE says and teaches. majority are simply uninformed or misinformed.

    i don’t think that by presenting an argument i’m compromising any of my or yours beliefs.

    YECHI ADONENU MOIRENU VRABEINU MELECH HAMOSHIACH LEOLAM VOAD!

    AMEN!

    MOSHIACH NOW!

    elka

  • The doctor says:

    Anonymous said…
    Well most adas women dress as the Rebbetzen Chaya Moushka did. So probaly the Rebbetzen is between the TALABAN CRONIES!
    =======

    The rebetzen dressed in adas style?? I don’t think so. Actually I have been told (in whispered tones) that the rebbetzen was quite a modern lady in various ways. Interestingly I googled her name for images and found that there are only 2 availbale of her. In both (one as a bride) she doesn’t seem to be wearing a sheitel. Could this be correct? Would that be the reason, that despite Chabad’s penchant for mass propaganda, there are virtually no photos of her around? Eg, googling the rebbe – one gets approx 10,,00 images.

  • proud BT lady says:

    yechi chaim glick said…
    “Had the rebbetzen outlived the rebbe, would she be able to remarry? Or would she syill be an eishes ish?”

    Anon: See Shulchan Oroch – Hilchos Eishes Moshiach, for the answer. It depends on numerous factors!
    ===

    You gotta be kidding, right?
    There are halachot in the Shulchan Aruch specifically for Moshiach’s wife !! Wow!

    Would there be a link to an English translation? These halachot would of great interest. Maybe the Women of Valour org (are they still around?) could bring us out a speaker on this topic? I am sure it would draw a crowd. Alternatively maybe we could get one of our rabbis to give us a shiur? Can someone suggest this to, say, Reb Arel or reb Klugant?

  • Anonymous says:

    David, time to close this topic down.

    It’s too stupid for words.

    Elka, talk to yourself. Anybody crazy enough to respond to her drivel deserves it.

    By the way, Elka is really Alex Leonard.

  • Anonymous says:

    yeah I think its leonard too. whata joke. go to bed elka/alex, you’ve outdone your usefulness.

  • Anonymous says:

    The distortion of facts is quite clear.

    a) Every Friday night Shabbas at the back of the shul, there are at least 10-15 persons talking during davening and before the last kaddish, the noise level rises rapidly until the kaddish cannot even be heard and the same 10-15 persons miss the merit to even answer AMEN.

    b) This scenario has been happening for years contrary to Shulchan Aruch and against the instructions of the Rabbonim.

    c) Now, you have a couple of guys who genuinely cry out for the redemption to arrive, AFTER davening has been completed.

    d) However, the “clowns who yell and scream Yechi disturbing the majority and making our shul into a circus”, are actually:

    1) reading the “sign” AFTER the last kaddish (ie: after the COMPLETION of tephila)

    2) can only be disturbing the persons who were;
    a) too busy talking during davening, and had to catch up later. Really?
    b) Beginning to study after davening. Really?
    c) Involved in “business chatter OR BLAH BLAH”. YES!!!

    So, if you are so concerned about the poor fellow whose “BLAH BLAH talk” is interupted by the reading of the sign (ie: with the intent and purpose to remind everyone that the Rebbe instructed his Hasidim to prepare the world to greet Moshiach), why don’t YOU make your own shul where you are allowed to talk during davening and it is forbidden to talk AFTER.

    Please wake up, “disturbing the majority and making our shul into a circus” is happening DURING Tephila every Friday night and NO ONE cares, NO ONE does anything, NO ONE wants to admonish anyone, because it is impolite to tell someone off (especially when it is the children of the people running the show!)

    The hateful attitude of these “clowns”, is out of proportion and really is just a self defense mechanism of people who feel threatened by others who are following clear guidelines by the Rebbe regarding how and when to “greeting Moshiach”- with Yechi…

    As for breaking the Psak, I would think that talking during davening is a VERY serious event, rather than reading “the sign” – which does not mention, “DO NOT SAY YECHI”.

    It seems the continual “talking during Tephila” is spitting in Hashem’s face (Hashem should have mercy on all of us).

  • Anonymous says:

    “who feel threatened by others who are following clear guidelines by the Rebbe regarding how and when to “greeting Moshiach”- with Yechi… “

    The guidlines of the Rebbe was to listen to our Rav.
    Could you please let me know where are these guidlines when, how and by whom should Yechi be screamt???

    How come when the Rebbe gave these guidlines this practice was not adopted nowhere not even in 770?

    Mates these Yechi nicks have totally lost the plot. Now there is even mention of 2 Moshiachs. What’s coming next??

  • Anonymous says:

    Message From Nutchi Glick!
    If our esteemed brother Reb Chaim Glick gets the endorsement to become Moshiach we offer free doughnuts to all!

    Nutchi- With what filling?
    Unless it has strawberry jam, Chaim can forget my support as Moshiach!

  • admin says:

    I’m really getting annoyed by all of these personal jibes, especially the ones that are posted anonymously! Probably time to close this blog down to comments – it seems people are incapable of civilised debate.

  • Anonymous says:

    What i don’t understand about this “ruling” of the rabbis, Why when it comes to issues of tzniyus the Rabbis are silent?! Or even talking in shule if they would throw out people who spoke during davening…
    There are so many problems in this community why do they have to Pick on this problem?!
    I discussed this with a friend who is not pro Yechi etc. and he said the same thing that they are giving attention to the wrong issues!

  • Anonymous says:

    This is crazy.
    3 Moshiachs!!

    1- Hashems Choice.
    2- Yechiniks Choice.
    3- Strawberry Jam Choice.

    Why not just prepare the world with Torah and Mitzos as the Rebbe taught us, and leave it to Hashem who Moshiach will be.

    It seems some are obsessed to campaign who should be Moshiach rather than to prepare the world for Moshiach, as the Rebbe kept telling us.

    The inyan of Moshiach is not an American style presidential election.

  • Anonymous says:

    I do not understand how some people can claim the Rebbe is Moshiach when the Rebbe said WE WANT MOSHIACH NOW! as well as clapped 100’s of times to these holy words.
    Obviously The Rebbe could not have been referring to himself.

    The Rebbes campaign “We want Moshiach Now” was only dropped and replaced with “Yechi” after the Rebbe took ill. Is this a coincidence?

  • Anonymous says:

    1. WHAT ARE THE SOURCES FOR SAYING YECHI AND WHAT DOES IT ACCOMPLISH?

    In the well-known sicha of Beis Nissan 5748 (Sefer HaSichos 5748, vol. 1, pgs 350, 351, 354), which marks 68 years since the Frierdiker Rebbe assumed leadership, the Rebbe discusses the concept of a Jewish king. The following are some of the main points of the sicha.

    The relationship between the melech and the people is manifested in two opposite ways. On the one hand, the melech is totally exalted above the people which inspires awe and fear of the melech. On the other hand, the relationship between the nation and the melech is one of absolute connection. As the Rambam says, the melech is the heart of the Jewish people. We are the limbs. The connection that exists between the heart and the limbs of the body is the ultimate of closeness. Just like the body receives its life-force from the heart, the Jewish nation receives its life from the melech.

    Not only does the nation receive its life from the melech, but the entire existence of the melech is dependent on the nation, as is written, “There is no melech without a nation.” The fact that the nation is removed from the melech directly affects his malchus – for true malchus of a melech pertains only to those who are removed from him.

    Therefore, the Rebbe continues, when the nation announces yechi hamelech, as was done in connection to Shlomo Hamelech and Dovid Hamelech, this affects not only the existence of the king, but the life of the melech as well.

    The Rebbe further explains that every year on the day of Beis Nissan, the nation gets an increase in life through the leader of the generation, and the people of the generation increase the life of the Nasi through the declaration yechi hamelech. This is all the more so in the year of 5748, which marks 68 (gematria of chaim) years of the Frierdiker Rebbe’s leadership.

    Therefore, when the leader of our generation has attained the completion of chaim years of his service and deeds, there must be a fundamental increase of life by the act of the people through their declaration yechi hamelech — for it expresses the fact that the time has arrived for “Arise and sing, those who dwell in the dust” — my honored father-in-law, the Rebbe, Nasi of our generation — and up to and including “Arise and sing,” Dovid Malka Meshicha. In fact, these words (except for Dovid Malka Meshicha) were added by the Rebbe with his holy hand when editing the sicha for publication. This is the general content of the sicha. It is understood from the sicha that saying yechi hamelech brings about techiyas hamaisim.

    The Rebbe also says that yechi hamelech brings the awakening of Melech HaMoshiach. It is interesting to note that we see a difference with the words that are used about the Frierdiker Rebbe. The Rebbe writes “Arise and sing, those who dwell in the dust”, referring to the idea of techiyas hamaisim. In reference to Moshiach, the Rebbe did not add “Those who dwell in the dust.” Only the words “Arise and sing” of Dovid Malka Meshicha are used.

    The Rebbe also points out that Melech HaMoshiach has a greater connection to the nation than an ordinary melech since the neshama of every Jew has the level of yechida, which is a spark of Moshiach’s neshama. Therefore, every Jew has the power to affect that which yechi hamelech accomplishes.

    2. Why don’t we just say the two words that are mentioned in the sicha, yechi hamelech? Why do we now say Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu Melech HaMoshiach L’Olam Va’ed?

    In the Beis Nissan sicha, the Rebbe cites Tanach as the original source for saying yechi hamelech. When one looks at the original source, it does not only say yechi hamelech, but it says Yechi Hamelech Shlomo, adding the name of the melech. In our case, this would mean that we say yechi hamelech and the Rebbe’s name. Since, however, we do not pronounce the Rebbe’s name, (even when called up for an aliya to the Torah, the Rebbe is announced as Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu ben HaRav Reb Levi Yitzchak), the appropriate expression to use is Yechi Hamelech Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu.

    It should also be pointed out that Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu is a phrase that Chassidim have been saying in the Rebbe’s presence for years. During every children’s rally, the children recited the 12 posukim and concluded with yechi. The Rebbe heard the announcement and accepted it. After the Rebbe said to say yechi hamelech, it is inconceivable that it meant that it is no longer acceptable to say Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu. In fact, it was continued at the rallies after this sicha.

    The words L’Olam Va’ed were added because L’Olam was originally used in reference to Dovid Hamelech when Batsheva proclaimed Yechi Adoni Hamelech Dovid L’Olam. The Rebbe refers to this in the Beis Nissan sicha and in the sicha of Parshas Toldos 5752 (Sefer HaSichos 5752, vol. 1, p. 133) where the Rebbe explains that Moshiach completes the reign of Dovid Hamelech. When the announcement of Yechi Adoni Hamelech Dovid L’Olam is made, the essence of Melech HaMoshiach is revealed. Only after this can Melech HaMoshiach be revealed through his activities.

    The words Melech HaMoshiach are added to Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu according to the content of the sichos of Beis Nissan and Toldos. These sichas say that the words yechi hamelech are intended to bring about the revelation of Melech HaMoshiach and are the coronation of Moshiach. Therefore the word Moshiach is added to the proclamation.

    The strongest endorsement that this announcement is proper is the fact that the Rebbe came out after davening, sometimes twice a day, sometimes more, and encouraged the singing of Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu Melech HaMoshiach L’Olam Va’ed with all of his strength.

    It is an avoda which the Rebbe guided, encouraged and inspired us to do. Once Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu V’Rabbeinu Melech HaMoshiach L’Olam Va’ed was said in front of the Rebbe and he accepted it and encouraged it time and time again, nothing more is necessary to show that this declaration is appropriate and acceptable.

    3. What is the source that yechi should be said, and not only could be said, after Gimmel Tammuz?

    Since announcing yechi gives life to the melech, and brings about the techiyas hameisim of the Frierdiker Rebbe and the awakening and revelation of Moshiach, how is it possible to even consider not saying yechi? On the contrary, during this time when there is a concealment, it is even more important to proclaim yechi in order to have the revelation and the awakening of Melech HaMoshiach.

    There is also another point. We can get guidance on how to act in our time by reading what the Rebbe said in 5710 after the histalkus of the Frierdiker Rebbe. One central theme which we see clearly in all of the sichos and all the letters of the Rebbe after 5710 is that there should be absolutely no change in any previous avoda and no weakness in any avoda that was done before.

    In one of the first letters after Yud Shevat 5710 (Igeres HaKodesh, vol 3, p. 237) the Rebbe writes… “we are still in total shock about the histalkus and it is very difficult to write letters…It is certain that the will of the Frierdiker Rebbe is and always was that there should not be, G-d forbid, any weakness in any avoda that was done under his leadership. And all those that are mekushar to him should only strengthen and reinforce themselves to continue to do everything as before.”

    There is another letter in the same sefer, p. 327. The Rebbe writes: “It is clear and it is certain that the intention of the Frierdiker Rebbe and his true will is that every kind of avoda should continue just like before. And not only in the quality and quantity as it was, but as in every avoda, it should actually advance and develop more than before.”

    This is found in the sichos as well. We especially see this in the sichos during Tammuz 5710. There is a sicha from Yud Beis Tammuz printed in Sichos Kodesh, p. 105. And in the sicha of Shabbos Parshas Shelach, p. 92, the Rebbe says not to change anything that the Frierdiker Rebbe told us. We should not even change the order of the way of what the Frierdiker Rebbe said.

    In fact the Rebbe says that because the meraglim made a slight change, ultimately they came to the point of totally rebelling against Moshe Rabbeinu. And therefore the Rebbe concludes that all the work of the Frierdiker Rebbe should continue as before and nobody should use their seichel to interfere and make changes.

    There are many other sichos and letters in which the Rebbe talks about not weakening or changing any of the work that was done under the guidance of the Frierdiker Rebbe. Some of the strongest words are found in a letter that is printed in Likkutei Sichos, vol. 19, p. 620. In this letter, someone asked the Rebbe whether or not he should continue doing certain activities. The Rebbe answered how important it is to actually advance and do more even though the person had valid reasons to stop. The Rebbe encouraged him to discuss it with the Lubavitcher Chassidim who work for his community. But the Rebbe says only those that are true community workers and those who are truly Anash. “And therefore, anybody who will tell you that it is better not to do, or someone who will try to weaken anything that you are doing which is in the spirit of the Frierdiker Rebbe, that person is not considered a community worker and is not considered of Anash of the Frierdiker Rebbe.” There is nothing stronger than this to prove the point.

    It is therefore understood that the same applies to us as well. As stated above, since the Rebbe encouraged the singing of yechi with all of his strength, it is an avoda which the Rebbe guided us to do. To stop, G-d forbid, or show any weakness in this is going completely against everything that it says in the sichos. An individual who would even consider showing weakness in saying yechi must bring sufficient and convincing evidence beyond a shadow of a doubt to justify that thought. The burden of proof, so to speak, lies upon that individual to show that it no longer applies. When one looks into the sicha of Beis Nissan and it explains what yechi accomplishes – techiyas hamaisim and the awakening of Dovid Malka Meshicha – and it will bring us to see the Rebbe again, face to face, how is it possible for someone to think that it does not aapply now?

    Based on article by:

    Rabbi Shloma Majeski
    http://www.moshiach.net

  • mother of 6 says:

    Rab Majeski:
    Since announcing yechi gives life to the melech, and brings about the techiyas hameisim of the Frierdiker Rebbe and the awakening and revelation of Moshiach, how is it possible to even consider not saying yechi?
    >>

    I am more confused than ever.

    Is all this ‘Yechi-ing’ going on to resuscitate the Frierdiker Rebbe and making a Moshiach out of him???

    If so, what happens to the Rebbe shlita? Will there indeed be 2 moshiachs – as someone posted? Or what?
    {It may indeed be a good idea to have 2 moshiachs – seeing that Chabad has become 2 religions already – with the Rebbe shlita being Moshiach for the Yechiniks and the FR for the others.)

    And what about the other 5 Chabad leaders?

    We don’t want them to have Techiyat Hameism? Of course we do.

    So then what another 5 moshiachs?
    It’s gonna get pretty busy there in Moshiachland. (Now there’s an idea to sell to Disneyworld).

    And then of course while we’re being mechayeh meisim for Moshiach purposes, what about the Baal Shem and the Maggid? Don’t they deserve a Moshiach guernsey?

    And for that matter what about David Hamelech? I mean, if anyone can claim Moshiachship, its got to be him!

    I really think the Meshichistic propagandists have a heck of a lot of explaining to do, other wise we punters are going to go around in a drunken maze.

    Rabbi Majeski – it’s all yours.

  • exMelbournian says:

    Isn’t it absolutely pathetic?
    The loonies are de-facto running Lubavitch – here and everywhere.

    What other group – Jewish or non-Jewish – anywhere, has been so successfully been hijacked by maniacs – who were taken on board by good, fine decent people – despite their obvious mental problems?

    Then to our shlemazel, a great and kind-hearted man, the rebbe, accepts some tambourine from a nutcase lady from Toronto (rather than shame her by refusing to take it) and suddenly it’s on for young and old!

    In hindsight, the rebbe should have been tough with these idiots and had them thrown out.
    But of course that was not his way. His Ahavas Yisroel knew no bounds.

    But I very much doubt, that even he would have been so understanding had he realized that his goodness and kindness will so be taken advantage of by the thousands of crazies that he allowed in. He obviously had no idea that they will end up destroying the greatest and most beautiful gathering in Klal Yisroel – since its dispersion 2000 years ago.

    Please think. In what other grouping of klall Yisroel do Johnny-come-lately BTs including former drug addicts and criminals prescribe the agenda?

    And they are encouraged by weak-minded and frightened rabonim and mashpiim who indeed find them ‘proof’ from the rebbe’s words himself for all their meshugaysim.

    Rabbi Majeski, I really expected better from you. Not much better, but still better.

    And to the remaining sane members of our community I say, throw out these lunatics before they throw you out.

  • Anonymous says:

    If Chaim Glick is the real Moshiach, who will make the holes in the bagels?

  • Anonymous says:

    Thanks God for giving us Rabbi Majeski who has given us the secret code what and why we need to chant in order for the Messiah to finally come. What a pity that Rabbi Majeski wasn’t around for the past 1000’s of years.

    If only our ancestors and the Rabbis through the ages would have known what Rabbi Majeski knows our people wouldn’t of had to spend thousands of years in galut being persecuted, tortured and murdered.

    Finally the Good Rabbi will lead us to Jerusalem singing on the top of our voices YECHI. Isn’t it all pretty plain and simple!

    Barry

  • Anonymous says:

    Glicks bagels will be holy even without a hole!
    Just leave it to Moshiach!

  • Anonymous says:

    Majesky, Shmajesky!

    Damn waste of bandwidth!

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka/Alex or whatever your name is!
    I am dissapointed. I asked a simple fair question and received a fair answer which was great until your following post.
    Your first post was critisized by some crazy person with a very sick mind. He says that Chabad will not accept Hashems choice and will have the Rabbe for Moshiach even if Hashem chooses differently. He then claims with his sick mind that if Hashem doesn’t accept his candidate then there will be TWO moshiachs. Instead of standind up to this heresey Elka you accept every word and even backtrack what you advised me by saying you do not believe what you wrote but we are all misinformed or uninformed!

    In what way are these Yechinicks any better than Christianity? You fellows have made a mockery out of the concept of Moshiach!

    I am sorry but I need to stand up for my G-D

    Avi

  • Anonymous says:

    forget elka forget chaim glick forget all else we have a new candidate avremi raskin

  • Anonymous says:

    Isn’t it time that we seriously consider medical attention to a small number of Yechiniks. The damage they are causing us is enormous.
    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    dear Avi,

    my personal belief is that the REBBE is Moshiach and it is based on the information i have on this subject. i think i’ve been consistent in this discussion. i know for a fact that most people don’t know enough about the REBBE’S teaching on the matter. you can judge this for yourself just by reading the comments on this blog. those who oppose “yechi” have not brought forward a single source to support their argument. this is why so much abuse is poured out here. they have nothing else to say. or call it emotional constipation if you like.

    even when it comes to Moshiach’s role (and not his identity) it seems that a lot of people have an image of some fairytale character in their head. who will give out lollies (or doughnuts for this crowd) and make everything ok. perhaps this is why you’ve came up with the question of “how will he feel…?”

    i really wish that you and many others would have an opportunity to learn more on the subject and make an informed choice for yourselves.

    wether we like it or not we are all in this together. and this situation with “yechi” proves it.

    i wish you well and good luck on your quest for truth.

    MOSHIACH NOW!!!

    elka

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka,

    If only you put a fraction of your efforts into doing what the rebbe said should be done in order to hasten moshiach, we would have all been closer to redemption. Istead you feed everyone within earshot a continuious diet of why the rebbe has to be the moshiach, resulting in disputation. This leads everyone further away from the goal, which it appears you have lost sight of. Most people who do what you do, have either had or still do have dysfunctional lifestyles, or are brainwashed BT’s who wish to force your evangelical beliefs down everyone throat, you can’t see why you’re not wanted, and more likely than not is the story of your life. It’s not too late. Get off your high horse and stop preaching. Most of us couldn’t care less about your beliefs and that’s why this blog has degenerated the way it has because frankly dear…No one gives a damn. You and your ilk get on peoples nerves, again most likely the story of your life. Try not to be a nerd!

    Now what part didn’t you understand?

  • Anonymous says:

    Why don’t we go back to basics and start preparing the world for Moshiach the way our Rebbe taught us:- THROUGH TORAH AND MITZVOS.

    Let’s stop speculating who will be Moshiach as nobody knows and nobody will know (see Midrash Parshas Vyechi) until Hashem in his mercy will send us Moshiach. So let’s preach love and push the Mivtsoyim as the Rebbe taught us.

    All this Amecican kind of marketing who should be Moshiach is kids games. Lets refocus and behave as the Rebbe would have wanted us to. If we show the BT’s through love, warmth and patience the right derech in chassidus I am sure most will change their direction. This concept that you need a hero, film star, pop star or sports team is a secular thing and many BT’s have unfortunately simply converted this urge of theirs into “a Yechi campaign”!

    With time and hard work we can help them come onto the right track- the way the Rebbe ran Chabad!
    Rabbi Groners mistake was that he thought if you give them a sign they will relax but the opposite happened.
    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    Avi!
    You can believe-
    The Head Shaliach Rabbi Groner and Dayan Telsner plus the vast majority of our community (as well as every single chabad Shule with their Rabbis in Melbourne)who all totally oppose the chanting of Yechi!

    or you can believe-Elka, Yellow shirt Zelig & Alex (plus a few more tipsy fellows)

    I know where I stand.

    No wonder the Rebbe taught us who to follow.

    Moshe

  • Anonymous says:

    lets get seious here for a moment shall we ? who is going to win the flag this year

  • Anonymous says:

    ALEX JEWsalinko

  • here is a link about frum teens, watch it and ask, what is truly important and what are we as a community doing about our young people?

    copy and pste it into your URL. This is a must watch.

    http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/video_viewer.php?player=g&clip=-2857216430678115550&hl=en

  • Anonymous says:

    Dear Elka,
    You have avoided commenting to the fellow that you are trying to please who suggests that there might need to be 2 Moshiachs.

    What is your opinion re sticking with the Rebbe as Moshiach if Hashem choices someone else.

    Would love to finally hear your thoughts in a direct honest way!
    I believe this fellow that you try to flatter and agree with is definitely an Apikoyras!
    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    YB!
    Don’t you think the majority of Yechiniks are Apikorsim?
    Check on the net http://rebbegod.blogspot.com/ how far this craze can go. I do not want to even hint what is suggested.
    We need a lot of Rachmonas that some should be psychologically healed NOW.

    Sarah

  • Anonymous says:

    From the Blog Haloscan:
    http://www.haloscan.com/comments/tzemach/111858300381648714/

    “Rabbi Shlomo Majesky, Dean of the women’s baal teshuvah yeshivah Machon Chana in Crown Heights, is the one person who is the most responsible for creating the Moshichist philosophy. He has guru like influence over thousands of balei teshuvha women whom he had been telling all during the Rebbe’s illness that the Rebbe could never pass away. He taught the women during the Rebbe’s illness that the Rebbe was not really sick since Rabbi Majesky taught that a tzadik is above nature. This goes against Chassidus but this is what he was teaching. Then the Rebbe passed away and Majesky was stuck. He had to come up with a philosophy that explained this otherwise Rabbi Majesky would have to tell his minions of female followers that he made a major goof up. He disappeared for a few days after Gimmel Tamuz and no one knew where he was. Then he emerged and began to spout the Moshichist philosophy we have all heard so often since then, saying that the Rebbe was not really dead etc. Rabbi Majesky did all this as a way of manipulating his followers so that he could maintain his position as a influential mashpia. Rabbi Majeslky is a pious fraud and is the one person who is singularly responsible for most of the strife and hatred and conflict in Lubavitch today. He pretends to be very holy when in reality he is Machivellian.”

  • Anonymous says:

    To Sarah.
    I agree that many Yechiniks are probaly crazy. I can accept your argument that some are Apikorsim. But you can’t have it both ways. They are either Meshugah and are not responsible for their actions or have the capacity to understand what they are saying and are responsible for their actions.

    Meshugah or Apikorsim Yes! But not both please! We can’t be that hard on them!!!!

    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    why is it that not one solitary person has adressed the main issue here.Is it too contraversial a question ,does it push the envelope that little too far is there not one among you all that can shed some light on this perplexing question? WHO will win the flag yitzchok new

  • Anonymous says:

    well ok then mr new if you must know i will tell you yeshivah under 12’S TO BEAT SCOPUS truley moshiach zeitin

  • Anonymous says:

    Yitzchok!
    Are you referring to the Yellow Moshiach flag that used to be on the roof opposite Yeshivah?- Probably Moshiach is not coming because the flag was removed!

    I hear Alex has a tattoo on his body of the Rebbe with the words “YECHI HAMELECH”

  • lubavitcher says:

    The following is a free translation of the Rebbe Rayatz’s “Kol Korei” dated 16 Sivan 5701 (1941), which I believe is particularly timely:
    To those who oppose and fight us! (“Answer a fool according to his folly”):
    In reaction to our call and warning of “l’alter l’Geula” (“immediately to the Redemption”), you have responded with the ridiculous yet terrible rejoinder that such is the stuff of missionaries!
    What has happened to you? Where is your knowledge of Jewish concepts? What is it that you believe in? Indeed, you are making a dire and foolish mistake. How can you ascribe one of the most fundamental beliefs in Judaism, the belief in the coming of Moshiach, to the nations of the world, just because they mention it (in their own way) in their preaching? Would you also surrender Shabbos, taharas ha’mishpacha, t’fillin, and tzitzis if the Christian missionaries began advocating them, too?
    Do you really not know that the belief in the coming of Moshiach is one of the fundamentals of our holy Torah, the foundation of all [the writings of] our Prophets and Sages?
    Do you truly wish to influence the masses of Jews to stop believing in Moshiach’s coming, as you are doing, by telling them that it is “treif” – just because the missionaries talk about a “Christian Messiah?”
    Will you ever be able to redeem yourselves and do teshuva for such a terrible sin? Making the belief in Moshiach loathsome to the masses of Jews, based on a stupid and fictitious argument?
    Nadav and Avihu, the two sons of Aharon HaKohen, offered a “strange fire” upon the altar of Israel and were burned for it. They received the greatest punishment, G-d forbid, because they introduced a strange fire to a place where only a G-dly, holy fire should have been. About this, the Torah warns us, “I will sanctify Myself in them that come near to Me.” For such a grave transgression there is no forgiveness, even for holy people like Nadav and Avihu, the two sons of Aharon.
    In your quest to defile the holy fire of belief in the Redeemer’s coming you are now doing the same thing, to our great misfortune, by introducing your own “strange fire.” Do you really want to bring upon yourselves the same terrible punishment, the burning of the soul and the demise of the body, G-d forbid?
    Do you not believe that Moshiach will come, our Jewish Moshiach, the one foretold of by our Prophets in the Tanach and by our Sages in the holy Gemara?
    To those who oppose us, I respond in the words of the wisest of all men, “Answer a fool according to his folly”: 1) You must obviously be hoping that our words will be revealed as fraudulent and that Moshiach will not come in the near future, just to prove that you alone are the wise and religious ones, and in order to retain your control over the Jewish people. But aside from the fact that you will be sorely disappointed, you should even now be ashamed of yourselves for opposing our Kol Korei. No intelligent person will ever believe that you pray to the Creator to send Moshiach, and you have already demonstrated your dishonor and shame by opposing those who recognize the truth better than you!
    2)       By disseminating the false, criminal, and ridiculous idea that to inform Jews of the imminent coming of Moshiach is “the stuff of missionaries,” very soon you will be forced to include on the list of “missionaries” (G-d forbid) the true and final Herald of the Redemption, Eliyahu HaNavi, who will imminently be confirming our Kol Korei. No doubt you will neglect to ask him how he knows [about the Redemption], just as you neglected to ask us, and he will certainly not approach you before he has approached the rest of the Jewish people.
    3)       You assume that your battle will bring you the reputation of being wise and practical religious leaders, but your illogical conduct has already established you as the opposite. You cannot really hope for Moshiach to come soon, as it will make you look like fools. And as for your piety, there is really nothing to say, as you failed to take this into consideration before waging battle. The words of the Prophet are being fulfilled, “Many shall purify themselves, and make themselves white, and be refined,” and people’s true faces will be revealed. By characterizing our call as “the stuff of missionaries,” you have very clearly demonstrated your lack of scholarship, fear of G-d, and basic intelligence.
    4)       Although you present yourselves as the spiritual leaders of the Jewish people, your words are designed to achieve the exact opposite: Very soon you will be forced to give an accounting, and bring upon yourselves the very greatest punishment, G-d forbid, if you do not immediately take back your sinful words and admit that you have made a terrible mistake. It is very clear that you must be the first ones to repent in full teshuva, more than any other members of the Jewish people.
    To those who believe, and to those who still have doubt!
    I now address myself to you!
    To those of you who believe in our Kol Korei, and to those who have doubts because of some supposedly religious Jews who are attempting to cool off your enthusiasm, we say:
    There is no need to rebuke you or to use harsh words, for this is not our way; we have only done so against our will, directed against those who are deathly apathetic and those who oppose us.
    But to you we say heartily, as one brother to another, words that are motivated only by Ahavas Yisroel: The hour has come!
    Now that the long-awaited and auspicious time has arrived that G-d is about to redeem us from the exile, we must cease being “Galus Jews,” with our own [petty] wants and needs. Rather, we must now be “Geula Jews,” in order to merit the immediate Redemption!
    Join our “Machne Israel,” which is not in competition with any other movement or in conflict with the wishes of any individual! Help us increase our numbers and do the work that is crucial at present on behalf of the entire Jewish people!
    Gravity is the call of the hour!
    Jews and brothers, be serious! Desist from small-mindedness and all petty individual ambitions. An entirely new age is upon us, a time of emergency, in which all individual ambitions will not see fruition.
    We are not trying to appropriate anyone else’s boundaries. We are not attempting to disturb anyone or impinge on anyone’s honor. All we want to do is awaken you and bring you merit, and make sure that you and others are aware of what is happening.
    We could no longer sit with our hands folded, watching what was happening and remain silent. We realized that we had no choice but to be the impetus for setting the Jewish world on the right track. We have pointed you in the right direction; from now on, it is yours! We have established HaKriya VeHaKedusha for this very purpose. We have initiated the creation of Machne Israel; let it be your work as well! Come, help us with genuine dedication to the cause, for the sake of the entire Jewish people! Help us conquer the final frontier, with G-d’s help. Help us remain strong and bring about miracles, for all other positions are pointless! From now on, all other strongholds will dissolve and crumble. We warn you that we speak the truth. It is for your own benefit that you believe us now, before you see it for yourselves. It will be your own tragedy, G-d forbid, if you wait too long for our words to be proven, and fail to perceive the truth in time.
    Gravity is the call of the hour! Pettiness has always been foolish; now it is actually life-threatening.
    “Immediate Redemption” is not an illusion or a religious wish. Not now – it is the call of the hour!
    The Redemption is on “the other side of the wall,” and it is fast approaching with rapid steps. Mighty fortresses will dissolve into fragments, nations and peoples will turn upside-down overnight. The entire world will be shocked, “but the word of our G-d shall stand” – G-d’s word, as transmitted through our Prophets, is going to be fulfilled in our own generation!
    Would that we all merit to remain alive with the rest of this generation, and achieve perfection with the chosen portion of humanity! As Jews, we can only attain this through complete and aggressive teshuva, with serious faith in G-d’s word and by anticipating the Righteous Redeemer. In this manner we will be worthy of greeting him.
    Have faith, be grateful and you will merit salvation and consolation! Believe in and obey our call, and G-d willing, you will be saved from the birth pangs of the Redemption! Believe, and you will be worthy of seeing the Geula!
    “L’alter l’Geula!” is the cry that you must now convey to your children. Tell them that G-d has remembered His suffering people, and He is about to redeem them from the exile and its troubles. And tell them that the dreadful agony of the Jews, wherever they may be, is G-dfinal warning to His children that they return to Him in teshuva, and go back to being Jews who are dedicated to the Torah.
    “L’alter l’Geula!” is our blessing to Klal Yisroel, and our wish that all our Jewish brothers share in the merit, Amen!

  • Anonymous says:

    yeshivah under 12 beating scopus wow i knew rabbi berger would bring great things to our community but i never thought this big

  • An outsider's perspective says:

    I’m relatively new to Chabad and the frum life style in general – I’m probably what you would call an ‘outsider.’ It’s always refreshing to get a perspective from someone who generally lives and thinks ‘outside the square’.

    Coming from a very secular background (I went to a reform high school and occasionally attended the local reform temple with my family) I find this ‘yehi’ business a little strange if not bizarre. I will never, ever say ‘yehi’ and feel a little akward every time I hear people screaming and singing it. Nevertheless, I have no problem with it – it doesn’t offend me. Come to think of it the whole redemption process itself with the concept of resurrection is bizarre…yet all G-d fearing Jews (including myself) accept it as truth. It defies logic just like the rest of the Torah and the Jewish people defy logic.

    However, what is even more bizarre if not plain disgusting is the behavior of some of ‘Lubavitchers’ (emphasis on quotation marks) who belong in the so called “non-meschiochist” camp. A good portion of this behavior is ever so eloquently displayed by the many comments made by various “Anonymous” posters here who have all mostly resorted to ad hominem attacks and pure slander. Terms like ‘heretics’ and ‘Evangelicals,’ ‘christians’ and ‘mishugenahs’ are commonly thrown around. Generally people who resort to ad hominem attacks usually don’t have much of a case to argue for. Outside of cyberspace it gets much worse than this with very voilent physical assaults – some of which I have personally witnessed on numerous occasions in Israel and the US.

    Please keep in mind that I’m not trying to get involved in the politics and taking sides – I’m leaving that to the politicians – I’m giving you all my own honest observation. Who are you to call another G-d fearing Jew a ‘heretic?’ Are you Torquemada? Or do you serve on a Bet Din? Who gives you the right to call another frum Yid a ‘christian’?

    Ironically, a NON-meshochist Rav recently asked similar questions. I’m talking about Rav Y Goldberg of Hadar Ha Torah. He is without doubt one of the greatest and most learned Ravs of our time – the epitome of a true Torah genius. And this is a man who would never ever utter the words ‘yehi.’ Yet he put Shea Hecht into his place after he opened his mouth in front of the entire yeshiva and quoted some so called “rabbis” who had declared the ‘messianic camp’ to be heretics. Rabbi Goldberg stood up and screamed “who are you to call another Jew a heretic? Who are you?” Oh and how I wish he was here to put all of you in your place. If a great and learned Rav like Y Goldberg is able to tolerate ‘yehi’ being screamed and sung by half of his yeshiva after davening everyday, three times a day and then go as far as stand up for their right to do so and speak out against any slander directed at them…who are you exactly? If this great Rav tolerates ‘yehi’ and goes out of his way to say that these people are not heretics – do you as an Am haaretz no better?

    If you were truly Frum and G-d fearing, you would think before you open your mouths or typed on a key board. You’ve let your smug egos guide you. Shame on you.
    Do shuva.

    And as eccentric as he is, I can also attest to the fact that Asher Zelig is a real mensch who is probably done more to bring Jews closer to Yiddishkeit than any of the arm chair observers who make up the Yeshiva Melbourne’s gentlemans club and prefer to sit on their backsides and within their comfort zones. Better to be fanatical and passionate about something than cold and comfortable like a large number of Lubavitch and non Lubavitch Jews in general who reside in Australia and the US. In a time when most Jews are switched off its nice to see one who is ever so passionate. Kudos to him.

  • Anonymous says:

    The two worlds of Mr Outsider’s Perspective taken from his Sermon!

    World 1

    -I’m probably what you would call an ‘outsider
    -someone who generally lives and thinks ‘outside the square’.
    -this ‘yehi’ business a little strange if not bizarre
    -I will never, ever say ‘yehi’
    -feel a little akward every time I hear people screaming and singing it
    -I’m not trying to get involved in the politics and taking sides

    World 2

    -plain disgusting is the behavior of some of ‘Lubavitchers’
    -who belong in the so called “non-meschiochist” camp.
    -Outside of cyberspace it gets much worse than this with very voilent physical assaults
    -If this great Rav tolerates ‘yehi’ and goes out of his way to say that these people are not heretics – do you as an Am haaretz no better?
    -If you were truly Frum and G-d fearing, you would think before you open your mouths
    -You’ve let your smug egos guide you.
    -Shame on you. Do shuva.
    -I can also attest to the fact that Asher Zelig is a real mensch who is probably done more to bring Jews closer to Yiddishkeit
    -Yeshiva Melbourne’s gentlemans club and prefer to sit on their backsides and within their comfort zones.
    -Better to be fanatical and passionate about something than cold and comfortable like a large number of Lubavitch
    -its nice to see one who is ever so passionate.

    Mr Outsiders Perspective has bought the meaning of “contradictions” to new levels.

    Just to show the honesty and mentality of some!

  • Anonymous says:

    To spread Yechi propoganda it is necessary to be an
    Imposter/ Phony/ Fraud/ Swindlers.

    “Mr Outsider’s Perspective” lecture, is just another confirmation.

    Kudos to him for trying to fool us. I have a good idea who it really is!

    M

  • admin says:

    Talk about getting off-topic! I will get to posting about my dear Tigers – perhaps then people will have the balls to post with their names?!

  • Anonymous says:

    An outsider’s perspective said…
    I’m probably what you would call an ‘outsider.’

    Please stay ‘an outsider’ as we have enough crazy insiders!

  • Anonymous says:

    Oh, I used to think so highly about those people who pray in Yeshivah
    I’d better never read this blog …
    So much hate, such uncivilized desire to hurt…
    I thought religion makes people better- obviously not everyone… I just realised that my secular friends can give lessons in Ahavat Yisrael to some Yeshiva goers
    Asher Zelig has inspired myself and my family (that 4 people) to become observant
    Our first ever Shabbos meal and many after we experienced in a tiny modest kitchen in his house
    He and his wife patiently taught us (and many others in a Russian-speaking Jewish community ) basics of a frum life
    There are many people around that can testify the same – they are thankful to Asher
    forever for inspiring them to do T’shuvah
    Asher is a selfless man devoted to Torah, Hashem and Rebbe
    It is appalling that all these unfair and disgusting remarks are made about such a holy man…
    Just because his view is different? Just because he is selfless and devoted enough to stand up for his beliefs , while many others with the same views prefer to keep quiet out of convenience

    Rivkah [full name redacted], McKinnon
    my husband just asked that I add his name – Moshe

  • Anonymous says:

    Mr Annonymous Outsider. (Hi E.G.)

    Those who want to scream and yell yechi can do so, but not where they are not wanted.You mention Rabbi Goldberg from Hadar. If his yeshivah and his hanholoah are happy to to it three times a day…good on ’em. It’s their choice.But being an outsider (which I don’t believe you are) you most likely would not be familiar with the term B’oifen Hamiskabel. When you have done some “post-graduate” research on the meaning of those two simple words, come back to us with your theories. In the meantime it’s clear to anyone with even half a brain, your mentor Zelig is simply getting up peoples noses by behaving in such a way that has earned him the contempt of the rabbis not to mention just about everyone else other than the dysfunctional element within Chabad. The rebbe , the same rebbe whom he worships as a god, always stressed the importance of listening to the rabbis. He and his ilk, think that in their messianic fervour to promulgate the rebbe is moshiach, they are above everyone else both in intellect and knowledge. That is the height of chutzpah, but is very symptomatic of psychotic individuals who screm out…“look at me. I’m not a nobody. I’m a somebody. I know how to buck the trend. Everyone is wrong. I am right”. He hasn’t converted anyone to his way of thinking. His macabre performances have not introduced one new face into the Yeshivah. On the contrary, people are leaving. He is a failure in private life and now that he has spurned the psak of the rabbis, he has shown himself to be a public failure as well. He’s on a mission and if he would have been born a Muslim, he would have been a top candidate to become a suicide bomber.

  • Anonymous says:

    Rivkah [full name redacted], McKinnon
    my husband just asked that I add his name – Moshe
    ———————————

    You respect him for not listening to the rabbis of the shul that he attends? Another Russian custom?

    Yossi M

  • Anonymous says:

    Rivkah & Moshe [full name redacted] from McKinnon! You have learnt from your looney friend
    -How to preach to us!
    -How to put down those that are not Messanic Jews!
    -How to have chutzpah!

    This institution was already arond before Zelig or yourselves even knew what Shabbos means. We have alot of work to do as our Rebbe taught us and no we will stand firm and not let a few Johnny come late crazies hijack the Rebbes Mosdos.

    I second the motion to take Zelig to McKinnon.

    It will definetly minimize the damage Zelig is causing by making all to laugh at us!

    Maybe Zelig should get a job and help fund the Rebbes Mivtzoyim and then he won’t have time to keep dragging Lubavitch into the mud.

    I respect BT’s but why can’t some of you also respect our community and our Rabbonim?

    Ber

  • admin says:

    Finally, we draw closer to a meaningful debate (in amongst the personal jibes):

    Does someone’s radical beliefs (in either direction) regarding the Rebbe and Moshiach automatically taint everything else good that they might do?

    I’m sure Zelig has influenced some people positively regarding frumkeit, and they have become more observant as a result of interaction with him.

    Would you say that (with respect to his influence on these people), he has done more bad than good?

  • Outsider's Perspective says:

    King David Secondary School is really a Lubavitch Yeshiva? I was there from year 7 right through to year 12 and never really noticed. I guess you learn new things everyday.

    I was very reluctant to give out my name because – judging by the irrational hate filled posts – it would be reasonable to assume that these posters are capable of anything and everything irrational beyond the realm of cyber space. But to prove that I’m not a fraud (and with David Werdigers instance), I will reluctantly submit my name…Leon (Levi) K [full name redacted]. I’m the real deal…you can occasionally catch me on a Sunday avo learning at Kollel, casually dressed and with a clean shaven face – I’m probably amongst the last people in the world who would wave a yellow flag and sing ‘yehi.’ Just as long as you don’t knife me in the back, by all means please feel free to approach me for a civilized discussion. And now that my Mother has given out her name (I urged her not too) I fear for her safety.

    Again with the ad hominem attacks and personal slander – mercilessly attacking the person and not the argument. As mentioned, people who usually do that and are unable or unwilling to engage in a civilized debate usually don’t have a case to argue for. And this is no exception.

    Am I talking with a bunch of immature high school aged students and/or just one or two crack pots who randomly post under “Anonymous?” If it’s not one or both of the two, then the Lubavitch community of Melbourne has a lot of reflecting to do. Heaven should help this community because nothing else will. Your typical Australian bogan is more civilized, rational and better mannered. And to their credit, the average bogan doesn’t follow or profess to follow a moral code which binds them to loving their fellow and to conduct their life in righteous and moral manner.

  • Outsider's perspective says:

    Some truly disgusting responses.

    No, I’m not trying to spread “Yehi” propaganda. Re-read my post – in plain english, I’m trying to defend a persons right to do so without being physically assaulted or branded a “heretic” at best.

    crickey, many secular Jews and Goyim are better well mannered and civilised then a lot of the ‘religious’ posters here.

    To the last anonymous poster who said – “You mention Rabbi Goldberg from Hadar. If his yeshivah and his hanholoah are happy to to it three times a day…good on ’em.”

    That’s not the point. If a great Rav and Dayan like that is able to stand up and clearly say (or should I say scream) that they are not heretics and to do so (label other Jews heretics) is pure slander and heresy intself…who are you? what does that make you? What right have you got to call other Jews heretics? Did you mention something about the Rebbe’s instance to “listen to the Rabbis?” That obviously has no meaning to you what so ever.

  • Outsider's perspective says:

    And to bring a muslim suicide bomber analogy into this??

    What a low life.

  • Anonymous says:

    Outsider

    You quote overseas rabbis?

    The concept in Chabad has been, is, and should be to listen to the “Rabbonim al asar”.

    You conveniently overlooked my earlier question if you knew what “B’oifen Hamiskabel” means.

    Look up what “Al asar” means. Then look uo “B’oifen Hamiskabel”. When you have done that, please post a response that addresses those points. No one is interested in what someone does or does not do overseas. By way of example, there are very vocal rabbis on par with your Goldberg, who not only believe the rebbe has not passed away, but also insist that he has not been buried next to his late father in law. Empty coffin? Giant hoax? Perhaps the next time round you might quote them and feign shock and surprise when I demolish your infantile arguments?

    Are you up to it, Mr Out of the square Outsider? Just answer my two questions; if you can!

    Once again, just in case you’re backwards…read my lips
    1. B’o i f e n H a m i s k a b e l

    2. A l A s a r

  • Anonymous says:

    Outsiders perspective posted

    Did you mention something about the Rebbe’s instance to “listen to the Rabbis?” That obviously has no meaning to you what so ever.

    Er, yes!! Which rabbis did you think the rebbe was alluding to? Ones that meet your criteria? Into shopping for rabbis now, are we? Hmmmm, is that what they taught your at the “reform high school and reform temple”? (your words not mine). Rabbi Groner and Rabbi Telsner not good enough for you? You need a Rabbi Goldberg from S**t Creek?

    Mordy

  • Anonymous says:

    Dear Outsider,

    i’m glad you find your inspiration some place else. i hope you don’t get discouraged by the nonsense and disrespect displayed here.

    there are Rabbonim and there are “rabbonim”. unfortunately they all wear similar uniform and claim the same authority. the shameless abusers here do listen to their “rabbonim”, the ones who watch silently when a fellow Jew is mistreated in shul, the ones who employ young people to physically remove Jews from shul for saying “yechi”, the ones who sign papers calling them ‘psak din’ with no reference to halachik source just to show who is the boss, the ones who instruct their followers not to discuss the subject of Moshiach….

    so be disgusted but not surprised by the behaviour of some people here.

    a day will come, hopefully very soon, when mr. a… (anonymous), will stop be anonymous and he and his mates will have to face his parents, children, grandchildren and explain his choices.

    until then our job is to identify Rabbonim among “rabbonim” and seek inspiration there.

    thank you for offering a fresh perspective to all.

    wish you well.

    MOSHIACH NOW!!!

    elka

  • Anonymous says:

    as an outsider who do you think is an outside chance to win the flag this year better odds you know what i mean

  • Anonymous says:

    and to david werdiger just cause you own this blog doesnt change the cold hard fact that your beloved tigers wont make the 8 put that in your blog pipe and smoke it

  • Anonymous says:

    Tigers…balls…?

    would that be footballs or basketballs?

  • Anonymous says:

    david you have really lost the plot if you dont think that talking footy is a million times more civil
    and constructive than this dribble anyway the tigers are going down

  • Anonymous says:

    Dear Elka,
    It’s great that you support the fraud Mr Outsider, but please answer the question that someone asked of you some days ago re if the Rebbe is NOT Moshiach. Or are you conviniently avoiding it as you have been caught out?

    Ber

  • Anonymous says:

    “Outsider’s perspective said…
    And to bring a muslim suicide bomber analogy into this??
    What a low life.”

    Who is the Low Life? – ZELIG?

    PS. We know who you are- but if you claim you went to a Reform sSchool you must be calling Yeshivah College Reform! Not very nice!

  • Anonymous says:

    ber lets be fair about this you answer my question first is it true richmond are favourites for the wooden spoon

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka,

    You’re quite ignorant, you know that? When a Rabbi gives a psak on a halachik question, he has to have a source. This yechi business is not a halachic question. It’s a question of an attitude to an inyan, a hergesh. Therefore other factors come into play such as what is in the community’s best interests, how is decorum meant to be achieved, how does one put the “Jack back in the box” etc etc.
    You’ll never accept that answer, simply because you will never accept anything other than a myopic view on life, everything being black and white, no shades of grey.

    Tell us, if Zelig and his ragtag army, you included, feel the way you do, why don’t you promote the same kind of activity in other Chabad shuls? You have no specific claims or rights to the Yeshivah, you believe yechi should be bellowed out after before or even during tefillos. Why is it an exclusive yeshivah thing? Why don’t you all practice what you preach and alternate venues so that others may be given the opportunity to follow your god? I dare Zelig to do his shtik at Yossels Chabad house? I dare Zelig to do it at Ohel Devorah. I dare him to do it at Malvern Chabad. I dare him to do it at Mendy Groners. Why leave out Adass? Caulfield shul? There are a multitude of people there whom he could try to convert. Fertile grounds for the pickings, yet he keeps on coming home to mama…the Yeshivah. Why is his bravado restricted to the Yeshivah? I’ll tell you why. Because he knows what will happen to him if he tries his shtik anywhere else. As crackpot as he is , he values his safety and his legal freedom. He understands full well that these other places have a “boss” and he knows full well that his nonsence will not be tolerated. Here at the Yeshivah he feels as if he has the freedom to do as he likes even though he has never contributed to the Yeshivah in his life. He doesn’t pay for a seat yet uses all the facilities the place provides. He doesn’t pay for the education of his children, he is a professional freeloader who has gone over the edge, refuses to be gainfully employed and simply sponges off the good graces of other people. And in he return he creates nothing but trouble. All in the name of bringing Moshiach by declaring who moshiach is? You have to be stark raving mad to accept such a warped logic.But then his background is…gimme gimme gimme.
    So Elka or whatever you want to call yourself, why not hightail it off to a place where you might be welcome. What’s wrong with the Chabadhouse down Carlisle St? The Israelis would love to see these performing monkeys. You would be treated like royalty. You could jointly save many souls. But none of you will go, will you?

    Why not Elka Freeloader? Why not?

    Mordy

  • Anonymous says:

    Why not invite your holy Asher Zelig to live in McKinnon? Please do it soon before he totally demolishes the goog work Lubavitch has done for over 55 years here.

    How holy were the massages that he gave?

    Do you also wear a yellow Moshiach T-Shirt?

    The Rebbe taught us to do acts that will bring Moshiach closer- Not secong guess who will be Moshiach and then drive everyone crazy with his propoganda!

    If you cannot see the point of the vast majority including our Rabbonim but choose your secular friends, unfortunately Asher Zelig has not taught you very well.

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    Dear Elka,
    You have avoided commenting to the fellow that you are trying to please, who suggests that there might need to be 2 Moshiachs.

    What is your opinion re sticking with the Rebbe as Moshiach, if Hashem chooses someone else?

    Would love to finally hear your TRUE thoughts in a direct honest way!
    I believe this fellow that you try to flatter and agree with, is definitely an Apikoyras!

    YB

    25 February, 2008

  • Anonymous says:

    i’ve answered the question before. if someone is not satisfied with my answer they should learn REBBE’s teachings on the subject. perhaps it will make things clearer. there are many texts which discuss Moshiach and redemption at length. for those who are interested they should make their own research. in return they will be able to draw their own conclusions regardless of what anyone else thinks/believes.

    good luck.

    MOSHIACH NOW!!!

    elka

  • Outsider says:

    ‘Anonymous’ eloquently stated – “Perhaps the next time round you might quote them and feign shock and surprise when I demolish your infantile arguments? Are you up to it, Mr Out of the square Outsider?’’

    Not exactly shy are you? They say that Moshe Rabbenu was the most humble person to ever walk the face of the earth. With that in mind it’s safe to assume that you come a good second best.

    No I’m not familiar with the two terms – which ones again goes to prove that I am who I claim to be.

    What difference does it make if he is overseas or not? If a great Rav clearly states that it’s a heresy to call your fellow Lubavitchers ‘heretics’all because their crime is to chose to say ‘yehi’, then it applies to everyone no matter where they are. With the exception of Rav Faital Levine there is no one else in Australia who can match the genius of Rabbi Goldberg. I’m therefore inclined to believe him.

    “Perhaps the next time round you might quote them…”

    but the thing is, I’m not and probably never will. Instead I chose to cite and quote Rabbi Goldberg – a man who will never ever utter ‘yehi’ and wave or touch a yellow flag. All those who claim to be Lubavitchers and disagree with the ‘yehi’ business must follow this Rav’s example.

    “You need a Rabbi Goldberg from S**t Creek?”

    Lost your marbles, Mordy?

  • Anonymous says:

    Outsider

    You say you’re not familiar with the two terms I referred to. I actually believe you.

    Do some homework, find out what they mean, come back when you’re done and see if you are able to justify your mentors actions.

    You’re not able to focus on the issues at hand are you?

    Bottom line, you and the other klotz have simply refused to answer direct questions. Your red-herrings responses are just “waffle, basically blah blah blah”, childish and amateurish. Go to bed Tinkerbell, way past your bedtime.

    Mordy

  • Anonymous says:

    Hey Outsider.

    You have great admiration for Rabbi Faitel Levine, you say.

    Go ask him if he believes Zelig should respect and obey Rabbis Groners and Telsners Psak.(ruling)

    Yossi

  • Anonymous says:

    Mr. outsider raised a very good point about Rabbi Goldberg. I spoke to a boy from Hadar Torah who didn’t like the whole approach to yechi. He told me that one time when he spoke to rabbi Goldberg about the Mishachist. Rabbi Goldberg said if a person is on crutches do you take the crutches away from them?
    Recently in Yeshivah it has became the First commandment of the Torah if a guy goes against rabonim’s “psak” you have to physicaly remove him from shule or the very least verbaly abuse him or even take away his belongings or make some kind of noise(bang the shtender whistle etc.) Otherwise you are not having kavod for the “Rabonim”.
    The fact all these disturbances(yelling,stealing, fighting etc.) are chasing people away. All these people are too emotionaly involved to think straight.
    I didn’t see any sign by rabonim saying you have to throw the guy out of shul, scream at him, etc.
    If everyone was as makpid in everything in Shulchan orech as they were in this matter. I think Melbourne would look frumer than Bnei Brak!

  • Anonymous says:

    If Faitel Levine rules that Groner and Telsner do not have to be obeyed by mispallelim of the Yeshivah, provided that ruling is circulated on his letterhead, I will offer Zelig a job no less than what he is collecting on the dole. It will mean though that he’ll have to work from 8.30am – 5.30pm. (Don’t worry Zelig, you’re safe, Faitel will never make such a ruling.

  • Outsider says:

    As I said, there are maybe one or even two Rabbis in Australia who match Rav Y Goldbergs genius in Torah.

    But yet there are probably none who could match his courage.

    I havn’t read the Hotham street psak din, but if it clearly brands those yellow flag bearers ‘heretics’, then I know for a fact that Rav Goldberg would refuse to go along with it and would strongly speak out against it.

    Mordy, no I’m actually waiting for you to enlighten me on what those two terms actually mean. Do the definitions have anything to with rubbishing a big Dayan from “sh–t creek?”

  • The beauty of the Chabad movement that I had the zchus to discover 23years ago was its intellectual libertarianism. All questions, ideas, and viewpoints were met not with harsh judgment but, with love and understanding. Not a single yid was ever made to feel as if they were wrong or inferior even if they challenged Chabad’s most basic theological principles. There were no sacred cows that Chabad as a movement did not allow for examination and scrutiny. Discussions on a myriad of topics could be heard everywhere people gathered, and BT’s were drawn in with ‘strong chords of love.’

    The Chabad I discovered was not at all preoccupied with Moshiach’s identity. If pressed, most Chassidim admitted they believed the Rebbe to be the best potential candidate to be Moshiach, but no one talked about it. It was understood that the most important thing was to bring Moshiach. People didn’t make an issue over what someone else believed, or how much the next person believed. There were no cross examinations to determine how Chassidishe anyone was. It was understood that a chosid’s beliefs were his own business and if he/she admitted their inner struggles with his own emuna or yiras shamayim, he/she was not shown anymosity, but on the contrary they were shown greater love and compassion. We knew in those days that showing weakness in faith can be a sort of strength, and we did whatever we could to help our fellow Jew to become stronger.

    So unlike these days. What happened to us? Where did that Chabad movement I discovered go?
    Our loving fellowship has been replaced with a deeply confused and conflicted society. This foreign dogma has crept into our ranks, and ever since this has happened what one believes and not what one does has become the most important issue. We now have certain people who have made themselves into ‘Moshiach Mind Control Police’ and they decide what is politically and spiritually correct. They decide who believes the right dogma or not, and how much those they judge believe in it, and if those they judge are worthy enough to bring Moshiach, and so on and so forth. The ‘Moshiach Mind Control Police’ are totally one hundred percent certain that they cannot be wrong in any of their ideas and interpretations, their point of view is completely black and white. To doubt them is to doubt the Rebbe himself, for they are the self annointed representatives of the absolute correct hashkafa, and only their interpretation of every nuance of every word our holy Rebbe ever uttered can be considered to be correct. They have even gone so far as to claim to be absolutely certain of the subtle meaning of the Rebbe’s slightest movements, of his facial expressions, of his tone, and of the nod of his head. There is no room for anyone’s hergish or opinions.

    And it is this certainty that disturbs me deeply. Some of us can agree that it is possible that the Rebbe could maybe be Moshiach, but we reserve the right to allow for there to be some doubt, we allow the possiblity to exist in our minds that Hashem could make it someone else. THat is why we refrain from saying Yechi. And for this reason, because we can admit in all humility that our understanding of such things it limited, that we cannot really know, for this we are often condemned as being of weak faith.

  • Anonymous says:

    mordy bowls an inswinger to elka and my goodness brett lee has won test cricketer of the year bye gilly

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka it seems you are Hell bent not to answer a simple question.
    Please don’t tell me to make my own conclusion. I don’t need your kind permission for that. What was simply asked was:- WHAT IS YOUR OPINION ON THE SUGGESTION OF YOUR FRIEND THAT IF MOSHIACH IS NOT THE REBBE SOME WILL NOT ACCEPT G-Ds CHOICE??

    You can choose to answer or not to answer but please don’t beat around the bush!

  • Anonymous says:

    Does anyone know where the money goes to, that Zelig collects around the Shules?

    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    this spotr nut among us makes the most sence at leasts there is no venom spewing from him i think his mesage is subtely saying why doesnt evryone just learn some tollerance and ahavas yisroel and stop this nasty personal bickering if yechi adds to your avodas hashem so be it if it doesnt so be it cant we just live and let live are there those among us who are so arrogant as to assune they have a mononoply on the correct shita dast chitas daven say rambabb do mivzooyim be besimcha say yechi dont say yechi whatever bit its time to move on from this ugly totally self indulgant personal point scoring and try to bring some nachas to the rebbe

  • Anonymous says:

    sorry few typos there but you get my drift

  • Anonymous says:

    bbahbdctNachas to the Rebbe.

    I agree we need to stop personal attacks. But as Rabbi Cohen put it the Rebbe has a Head Shaliach who understands that those people who yell in shule their personal beliefs must be stopped before there will be no one left in Shule. Rabbi Cohen suggests calling the police who would probably charge them with being a public nuisance.

    If I would yell out on the top of my voice all the time that Moshiach is arriving this Friday at 12 noon wouldn’t I have been thrown out of every shule including 770. I have seen people treated much worse at 770 for causing much less commotion and disruptions.

    Every other shule in Melbourne is growing in numbers while we are allowing a few to satisfy their own urges. Nachas to the Rebbe will only be achieved when the Head Shaliach and the Dayan will resume the power that the Rebbe instructed they have. Besides every time they scream their Yechi more and more are openly making a joke of us, of the Inyan of Moshiach and sad to say of the Rebbe.

    Just ask what many of the teenage boys are saying in the school yard. How can we stay silent? There are children from good homes who not just make a joke of Lubavitch but unfortunately even eat in non kosher restaurants and even worse. Will Zelig and his supporters take responsibility for this? Why isn’t Yeshivah attracting decent non Lubavitch families? Just think of the damage that this craze will continue to cause if we don’t stop those that defy our Rabbonim NOW.

    If we do not support our Head Shaliach NOW we are simply hurting the Rebbe and all his work particularly regarding pushing the arrival of Moshiach instead of continually yelling who is moshiach which has nothing to do with the Rebbes instructions to us.!

    Some time ago I asked how come on our website nothing is mentioned re Moshiach. I was told that people will associate it with the crazies!

    Is this giving Nachas to the Rebbe?

    Ber

  • Anonymous says:

    Ber

    what about THE SIGN?

  • Anonymous says:

    Wouldn’t it be assur to enter a lavatory wearing Zeligs Yellow T-Shirt?

    Sarah

  • Anonymous says:

    According to many the sign was a mistake. Rabbi Groner wanted to compromise and thought this would keep all happy. But my boy was he wrong.
    The crazies just kept going. I have heard that if the psak doesn’t quiet the crazies down, the sign will come down. I am not sure if I believe this. Time will tell.

    But to answer your question
    1)the sign does not upset people 2) Does not interupt people davenning. (And yes people who talk in shule are also told of!)
    3) The sign was done under the guidance of the Head Shaliach oif the Rebbe- (not a free for all mentality).

    Ber

  • admin says:

    Some months back, Zelig posted a receipt from an institution in Israel that helps poor people in respect of the funds he collected for the year. I don’t recall the amount – it was several thousand.

    Please stop this awful innuendo, or be prepared to walk up to Zelig (or anyone who posts here) and say these things to his face!

  • Anonymous says:

    THE SADDEST PART IN ALL THIS IS THAT WE HAD TO SUBJECT OUR RABBONIM TO GIVING A PSAK ABOUT ANNOUNCING YECHI I DONT BELIEVE THEY WOULD HAVE TAKEN A STANCE HAD THEY NOT BEEN PRESSURED OR WHATEVER I DONT SCREAM YECHI BUT IN A WAY IM HAPPY THAT SOMEONE DOES OK TRUE FACT IS THAT OUR RABBIS SAID NO MORE BUT THATS SAD CAUSE I DONT THINK THE PEOPLE WHO IT OFFENDS ARE CONCERNED WITH ANYTHING OTHER THAN A DISTASTE FOR LUBAVITCH AND 77O FINALLY I CAN ASSURE YOU IF OUR YOUTH ARE LEAVING IT HAS ABSOLUTLY NOTHING TO DO WITH YECHI

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    I DONT BELIEVE THEY (Our Rabbonim)WOULD HAVE TAKEN A STANCE HAD THEY NOT BEEN PRESSURED
    .. OUR YOUTH ARE LEAVING IT HAS ABSOLUTLY NOTHING TO DO WITH YECHI

    If our Rabbonim do not say what they know is the right thing by the Torah and the Rebbe we should appoint new Rabbonim!

    Just ask the kids what turned them of Chabad and Yiddishkeit!

    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    LET’S REPLACE GRONER WITH RABBI ASHER ZELIG. GRONER IS PAST HIS USE BUY DATE.

    YECHI ZELIG!

  • Anonymous says:

    Why don’t one of Zelig’s supporters find him a job. If he wouldn’t be so bored half our problems would be solved.
    Sarah

  • Anonymous says:

    ber you are so full sh## i dont say yechi but if the truth be told im glad someone did say it in our shul and im saddened that our rabbis had to pasken against it for whatever reason they did i doubt had the opponents of yechi complained they would have made an issue about this.i dont know you but i know what motivates you and its not koved for our rabbonim its not that our children are leaving you simply like homon could not stand mordechai you can not stand yechi lubavitch 770 etc and if the truth be told if god forbid any child turns away from lubavitch it wont because of three perhaps misguided hopefulls it will be because you and your ilk spew hatred and venom

  • Anonymous says:

    YB
    Does anyone know where the money goes to, that Zelig collects around the Shules?

    ————-
    Zelig collects money for needy Israeli families.

    Rivkah

  • Anonymous says:

    Could Zelig please show ANY Rabbi that the money goes to poor families in Israel. I have been told it is for the Yechi campaign!

    I hope I am wrong but it should be confirmed. Some transparency would help Zeligs reputation (although he must accept that in Yeshivah the Rebbe put Groner in charge and not him).

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    Wouldn’t it be assur to enter a lavatory wearing Zeligs Yellow T-Shirt?

    Sarah
    —————————-
    Anonymous said…
    Wouldn’t it be assur to enter a lavatory wearing Zeligs Yellow T-Shirt?

    Sarah
    —————————-
    Strictly according to Halacha it is probably permitted but it is very disrespectful for a chosid to wear clothes with the Rebbe’s image on it to a bathroom. We should treat the Rebbe’s picture as holy and holy things are prohibited! (This is what Reb Faitel Levin said today).

    Yank

  • Anonymous says:

    i really dont get how anyone could hate a guy like zellig as much as you seem to hes quite harmless you know

  • Anonymous says:

    I don’t think people hate Zelig. I personally think he is a very confused simple fellow who is being used by some to do their dirty work.

    I feel sorry for Zelig but he must be contained.

    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    Everyone cares so much about the shitas of the Rebbe, while there hangs a sign outside Beth Rivkah, with a picture that is there to display the school’s stand with regards to Zionism, r”l.
    Anyone who has done just a little bit of learning knows the Rebbe’s (and all the preceding Rebbes’) opposition to Zionism and all that is connected to it.
    I heard a story from an undisputed chassidishe yid in Crown Heights who told me he once overheard the Rebbe speaking to Rabbi Chaim Gutnick OBM in a yechidus. He wasn’t evesdropping. He was sitting in the upstairs zal when he heard screaming from the Rebbe’s room. He and his friend went to see what happened. They were taken aback when they heard the Rebbe, in the midst of the discussion, scream out painfully, “it’s NOT aschalta digeula, its not aschalta digeula!”
    The Rebbe then went on with the famous Chabad Shita against Zionism, which, unfortuneately, as great as they were the Gutnicks were never able to see.
    All I am saying is, instead of being busy arguing what the shita is, fight where it is undisputed. Rabbi Gurewicz chooses to sing hatikvah when all know that Lubavitcher Yeshivah in NY lost the Rebbe’s auspices as a result of it being sung at a function…

    To me, the two topics are very interconnected. Those who are very anti the mishichist movement, to the extent that they classify them as heretics, are usually the same people who identify themselves as Zionists. To the Rebbe there is no such thing as Lubavitcher Zionist…
    The Rebbe loved Eretz Yisrael more than anyone (needless to say more than all of the state’s politicians and those who claim to lead it) and he was still vehemently opposed to the whole Zionist ideology.
    Let’s put our feelings aside and adopt those of teh Rebbe.
    What would the Rebbe ratehr: some lunis screaming out be’emes about him, and even though not in a correct way, in essence a correct ideology, OR for us to fight and end up changing our basic shitas of Chabad based on these “lunees”…?
    Rabbi Cohen never changed his opinion. He thought it OK to believe the Rebbe is Moshiach and even announce it, but didnt feel the neccsity for himself to be a part of it. He held that it is a totally justifiable and legitimate idea “BASED ON THE REBBES TEACHINGS”. He still believes all that, and will not change his view because he is a well thought out man, and a intellectual. He will not change because some lunees are embarassing him. He still thinks it is a fair belief…
    Think about this.
    Yossi

  • Anonymous says:

    Dear Yossi
    The letter that I read from Rabbi Cohen suggested that if these Yechi nicks doi not stop chanting in our shule and do not obey the Rabbonim then the police should be called!
    Sarah

  • Anonymous says:

    I am told some real chassidim leave their daughters home from School on Yom Hatzmut due to the message which is taught.

    Mr G is a zionist totally condradicting the shita of the Rebbe as well as the Friedieker Rebbe.

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…

    >ber you are so full sh##:- THAT’S A LOVELY WAY TO START!
    >i dont say yechi but if the truth be told im glad someone did say it in our shul:- SO WHY DON’T YOU SAY IT?
    >and im saddened that our rabbis had to pasken against it for whatever reason they did:- OUR RABBIS PASKEN ACCORDING TO THE TEACHINGS OF THE REBBEIM AND THE SHULCHAN ORACH!
    >i doubt had the opponents of yechi complained they would have made an issue about this.:- YOU ARE QUESTIONING THE CREDIBILITY OF THE REBBES HEAD SHALIACH – SHAME!
    >i dont know you but i know what motivates you:- YOU SEEM TO BE A NAVI!
    >and its not koved for our rabbonim:- POSSIBLY I AGREE, BUT IT IS DEFINETLY FOR THE KOVOD OF THE REBBE AND HIS INSTITUTIONS!
    >its not that our children are leaving:- STOP LIVING IN DENIAL!
    >you simply like homon:- WHY DO SOME YECHINICKS LIKE YOU NEED TO CALL OTHERS HOMON? DOESN’T THIS SHOW SOMETHING!
    >could not stand mordechai you can not stand yechi lubavitch 770 etc.:-GROW UP PLEASE!
    >and if the truth be told if god forbid any child turns away from lubavitch it wont because of three perhaps misguided hopefuls:- GO AND TALK TO 16 YEAR OLD STUDENTS AS I HAVE, YOU WILL BE SHOCKED!
    >it will be because you and your ilk spew hatred and venom:- PLEASE LOOK IN THE MIRROR- DON’T THINK WE ARE ALL LIKE YOU!

    Ber

    What about getting all your holy cult and have a shiur in AHAVAS YISROEL- Even if you don’t like people disagreeing with your newly found religion.
    And you preach tolerance to people who have built this community for over 50 years.

  • Anonymous says:

    ok ber i took your yor advise i spoke to a disenfranchised student in the school and was told in the clearest plainest way so that even a lubavitch hating jew like yourself could underestand that what he found to be objectonable was the way those three yechi screaming people were treated in the kollel on shabbos was the most obscene thing he had witnessed far more offensive than their shouting,and i maintain that i do not yell yechi not because i dont beleive it has merit but because i dont feel i am the right person to say it so that it should be niskabel but if it is said it doesnt bother me at all in fact i like hearing it i cant argue with our unelected non merutzeh rabbonim and i dont but i dont look to them as a rebbee or to their words as so holy that i hang my hatred of others on their psak and hide behind it

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    >ok ber i took your yor advise i spoke to a disenfranchised student in the school and was told in the clearest plainest way so that even a lubavitch hating jew like yourself could underestand that what he found to be objectonable was the way those three yechi screaming people were treated in the kollel on shabbos was the most obscene thing he had witnessed:- SO THIS IS WHAT TURNED HIM OF YIDDISHKEIT. HE WAS DAVENING IN THE KOLLEL JUST A VERY SHORT TIME AGO- AND NOW HE IS TURNED OF YIDDISHKEIT BECAUSE THE WAY 3 WERE TREATED. -TELL ME IS BEING A YECHINICK OBLIGATE YOU TO BE DISHONEST? PLEASE SPEAK TO THOSE THAT LEFT YIDDISHKEIT BEFORE THAT SHABBOS.
    >far more offensive than their shouting,and i maintain that i do not yell:- NO NEED TO MAINTAIN ANYTHING!
    >yechi not because i dont beleive it has merit but because i dont feel i am the right person to say it so that it should be niskabel :- SO YOU MAINTAIN THAT IT IS MISKABEL FROM LOONEYS!
    >but if it is said it doesnt bother me at all:- BUT IT BOTHERS NORMAL HONEST PEOPLE!
    >in fact i like hearing it:- SO IT’S ALL ABOUT SATISFYING YOUR URGES?
    >i cant argue with our unelected non merutzeh rabbonim:- YOU MEAN THE REBBES SHLUCHIM?
    >and i dont but i dont look to them as a rebbee or to their words as so holy that i hang my hatred : YES YOU HAVE PLENTY. AND AS I SUGGESTED YOU HAVE A LOT OF WORK TO DO IN AHAVAS YISROEL BEFORE YOU CALL ME “HOMON” AND “A HATER OF LUBAVITCH” WELL I AM TRYING TO SAVE LUBAVITCH FROM DESTROYERS AS YOURSELF AND YOUR CRONIES!

    Ber

    A LITTLE FAVOR: PLEASE FIND A MASHPIA WHO CAN HELP YOU TO GROW UP -AND LEARN WHAT EMES AND AHAVAS YISROEL ARE ALL ABOUT. AND IF YOU HAVE SPARE TIME ALSO ASK ABOUT THE CONCEPT OF DOING WHAT THE REBBE DEMANDED- TO LISTENB TO RABBONIM AL ASAR. AND MAYBE A LITTLE KOVOD TO THE REBBE’S SHLUCHIM?!

  • Anonymous says:

    Ber! Why bother answering such fruitcakes!
    They are their own worst enemies. Once you read their rabble you understand that they are bad news.

    ANASH

  • I know Zelig for years pretty well. I disagree with Zelig but he is not a bad person, only a confused one. I do not believe he would collect tzedaka on a false pretext. He sincerely believes he is fighting the Rebbe’s cause. He is one of the many minions who have become brainswashed by the ideas spread by the manipulators and the gurus among Chabad. They are the ones who are truly to blame for creating the Zeligs and the Alexes of Chabad.

  • Anonymous says:

    i wonder ber what you would do if you lived in a place where the rabbonim rebbes shluchim unelected despots whatever you chose to call them said yechi is a good thing to say /. would you be so bottle as to accept the ruling there clearly is no yes or no answer to the yechi question each chosid should refer the matter to his own cincsience or his mashpiah in our shul it has been decided yechi is not appropriate fine let it be removed i hope that now allows you to act as a true chosid and stop attacking those 3 people who were only doing whatever they could to bring moshiach speedily in our day i hope you dont object to demanding moshiach hurry up and come but alas i feel you probobly think this too is innapropriate we should all just sit back and let him arrive in his own good time well sorry mate thats just wrong

  • 770 says:

    David,
    I agree with you. Zelig is a selfless man who puts others before himself.
    On Erev Yom Kipur when everyone is running around doing their preperations for Yom kipur. He is standing outside the mikvah for hours collecting money for the poor of Israel. Which he makes sure every cent goes directly to the one in Israel who distributes it to the poor.
    Likewise on purim he goes around yeshivah adas kimberly etc and collects money for the poor of Israel for literaly hours.
    The same is with His t’shirt, yechi and dancing he wants to convey the message of the Rebbe to whomever he could reach out of love he is not against anyone including the rabonim.
    He has alot of mekuravim as you can see. He is always one of the first to don tefilin with the newcomers to shule especialy the Russian jews.
    I think if everyone would be tolerant of the other…
    I have tolerance for the people of the shule because of their talking I have missed out on plenty of kadeshim.
    If people could have tolerance of 15 seconds of someone’s beliefs and passions. Which were encouraged and directed by the Rebbe.
    If Yechi realy bothers people there is plenty of
    Shules in Melbourne that don’t say Yechi.
    My young son is confused by this double standard that in kolel Yechi is said but in the main shule it’s not always said.
    I think the Rabonim have to explain the sichos and take a stand instead of throwing the issues under the carpet. It is detrimental to everyone in the community especially the Youth whom many have never even seen the Rebbe.

  • Anonymous says:

    Somebody mentioned about appointing new Rabonim.
    I don’t remember which year but in the 80’s the Rebbe insisted the whole community go to vote for eligible rabonim and that is how the crown Hights beis din was appointed and the Rebbe said at the time since the majority of the community appointed them it gives them a very great stregnth.
    Recently(last year for those who have memory lapses) our community board executive who were appointed by Groner(not the community at large) decided to take Groner’s son-in-law on board.
    Groner even said to those who might oppose the move; even if half the community oppose this I still am going to have my son-in-law as dayan.
    My point is in this community you don’t elect the executive,dayan or even gaboyim. Everything is from above to below. Which makes alot of people(including my self) as if you are a second class citizen. ITS US(THE HIGH OFFICALS) AND YOU(THE SECOND CLASS CITIZEN!

  • Anonymous says:

    Is the issue to bring Moshiach ASAP, or to push for all to agree with those that believe they know who Moshiach is, and take away from Hashem the right to give us WHOEVER HASHEM WANTS as Moshiach. One crackpot went as far as saying if G-D chooses someone else as Moshiach we will have 2 Moshiachs.
    All chassidim from many Rebbeyim cry for Moshiach, now and in yesteryears but the Yechinicks are the first to demand that all need to accept the Rebbe as Moshiach. A trend that was unheard much before 1994!
    Please forgive me to disagree with you, this campaign has nothing to do with “We want Moshiach Now” ! It is a cult to get all to believe that the Rebbe is Moshiach. This is two total separate things.

    I agree that there might be some Dictatorship but am convinced the vast majority do not want this Yechi stuff (same as ALL other chabad houses!)
    I also agree Zelig is a noble man but has let himself be misguided by a few. My issue is lets not confuse wanting Moshiach to a campaign of who should be Moshiach. Some are being mischiveous trying to link these 2 seperate issues. All frum jews through the generations have wanted Moshiach but none went around screaming who they barrak for to become Moshiach. No Yelling, no T-Shirts, no posters, no bullying and no brainwashing!

    It is sick to see Israeli backpackers arriving by car to DUDU late friday night and then (boys and girls) singing Yechi!

  • Anonymous says:

    Could someone be that kind to let me know where I can find material on the true Shita of Chabad concerning Zionism!

    Sarah

  • Yechi Hamelech says:

    Excuse me mr. annonymus who put down dodo. The Rabbonim with Rabbi Groner at the head endorse Yechi look at the sign in the back of Shule.
    The third sign put up which must have costed them a few thousand dollars to put up.
    Dodo Lieder is one of the only Shluchim in Melbourne who pushes that yechi is said and is instrumental in educating people of the sichos of 5751-5752.
    The Rebbe encouraged Yechi for a whole year. And even before the stroke the Rebbe gave many people encouragement of publicizing that the Rebbe is Moshiach. And you should educate yourself and see the sichos: 2nd of Nissan 5748 edited by the Rebbe. where the Rebbe explains the concept of Yech Hamelech. And Toldos 5752 where the Rebbe explains the declaration of Bas Sheva to Dovid Hamelech on his Death Bed “Yechi Adonee David Melech Leolam”.
    In general you should learn all the sichos of the Rebbe and especialy the Sichos from Parshas Shimini 5751 and until Vayakel 5752 where countless times the Rebbe clearly indicates he is King Moshiach.
    Yechi Adonainu Morainu Verabainu Melech Hamoshiach Leolam Vaed!!!

  • Anonymous says:

    What is happening to our Rabbis in Sydney? According to the AJN they have approved going to a concert in the 3 weeks. Are our Rabbis becoming Reform?

    Moshe

  • Anonymous says:

    SARAH! THE FOLLOWING YOU WILL NOT LEARN IN BETH RIVKAH!

    The Previous Rebbe’s Harsh Words About Secular Zionism!

    Over 60 years ago, the Frierdiker Rebbe spoke a out against the Zionists (Sefer Hasichos 5705)

    Quote:
    Jews! Men and women!

    In the Land of Israel, Jewish children are slowly being destroyed.
    Anti-religious people among the group of leaders who are responsible for the orphaned refugee children in Israel, have created a “Shmad corner” for the children who have been entrusted to their care.

    In the places in Europe conquered by Hitler, Yemach Shmo, he set up extermination camps to torture and burn Jewish bodies; in Israel, a certain group has set up extermination camps to torture and destroy Jewish souls.
    The “Shmad corner” which is actively prosletyzing the Jewish refugee children, is educating the children by Hamans who are dedicated to the same path and education as the men of the Yevsektsia, the evil ones.
    The “Hamans” teach the children to violate Shabbos, to eat Treif, to eat on Yom Kippur, to eat Chametz on Pesach. They don’t even allow the children to say Kaddish for their martyred parents who were killed Al Kiddush Hashem. They teach the children to ridicule G-d and Yiddishkeit.

    The orphans who are being educated by the ‘Hamans’ [will grow up to] tear up Sifrei Torah,burn down Batei Knesiyot, destroy Jewish cemeteries, lead pogroms, stab, burn and shoot at Jewish bodies. They will rob and loot Jewish property…

    From the Rebbe RASHAB!

    In answer to your questions concerning the Zionists and their group (which they propose to found) I will state, in short, the following:
    1. Even if the Zionists were G-d fearing Torah true Jews, and even if we had reason to believe that their goal is feasible, we are nevertheless not permitted to join them in bringing our redemption with our own strength. We are not even permitted to force a premature redemption by showering the Almighty with insistent entreaties (As Rashi comments on the Gemara Kesuvos 111A discussing G-d’s adjuring the Jewish people not to force the redemption), and certainly not by means of physical force and devices; We may not end our exile by main force: we will not thereby, achieve the spiritual redemption for which we are waiting. The Zionist notion contradicts our hope and yearning that G-d himself will not bring about our Redemption .
    The past redemptions which were wrought by human beings were therefore incomplete. The redemption through Moshe and Aharon after which further exiles followed, and the redemption through Chananyoh, Michoel, and Azaryoh, although they acted in accordance with the prophecy of Yirmeyohu and other prophets are cases in point.
    To insure a permanent Redemption from our present exile, we must hope and wait for a deliverance by the Almighty Himself, and not through the hands of one of flesh and blood. Thus only will our redemption be complete.
    2. All their plans are built upon fantasies. They will not materialize, for there will never be an agreement to them. And besides our natural characteristics are not suited for it. Their leaders are blinded and bribed by their wish for freedom and power, and the ignorant masses follow them blindly.
    3. The main point: The leaders of this project are totally hostile to G-d and His Torah. Their desire and interest is to cast off the yoke of Torah and Mitzvos, substituting nationalism for Judaism. Recently one of their leaders circulated a statement publicly blaspheming Judaism and boldly stating that a Jew is not necessarily someone who observes the Torah and mitzvos, etc. They state that many mitzvos of the Torah are-may their mouth be shut–a disgrace to the Jewish people. They plan to instill these ideas in the young by controlling the school system. Their purpose is to inculcate them with negative attitudes toward G-d given Torah and mitzvos and substitute the banner of nationalism as their guiding force. One of their leaders “reformed” the Torah, omitting those verses, passages and laws that did not please him. He is ready print this “new Torah”, and this is what will be taught in the Zionistic schools.
    One of the activities of the protected group will be to help finance schools of the above-described type. Although the goals of the bank are said to be to rebuild and repair destroyed roads, and so on, as their program depicts, it, will in fact direct its forces primarily toward the youth and the culture and implant in the children and adolescents poisonous roots. Their emissaries, the Zionist preachers malign Hashem’s Prophets including Moshe, the master of all Prophets at will.
    Woe to us that we must witness these tragic events in our time.
    The Zionists true desire is to sever the hearts of the Jewish people from the Torah and mitzvos, G-d forbid, and to debase in their eyes whatever is regarded as holy by our nation.
    This is their leaders’ goal, and “the body follows the head.”
    If the Zionist plan to take possession of the land will G-d forbid materialize, they will defile it and disgrace it with their abominations and misdeeds, causing our exile to be lengthened, chas vesholom.
    After considering these points, dear brothers, do judge whether G-d desires their actions and whether these people will bring about the salvation of K’Lal Yisroel. No!
    We will not accept their promises. Even if they have some good to offer, we must throw it back to their faces. We do not want their good. We accept only the good from Hashem that results from the fulfillment of Torah and mitzvos. The Torah promises, “If you shall guard my statues I will give rain in its season and material abundance.”
    It is this good we want. And that is our only cherished hope. Those who aid the Zionists will in the future be held accountable, for they support those who cause the community to sin.
    Therefore, anyone who belongs to Hashem’s camp shall not join the evildoers, but on the contrary, he must oppose them as much as he is able to do. Until it shall be G-d’s will to redeem us, we must accept the yoke of exile upon ourselves, since the exile expiates our sins. We must strengthen ourselves to withstand every new wave by fulfilling Torah and mitzvos, as G-d requires of us, hoping that Hashem will soon bring our redemption and send Moshiach. If he tarries let us wait for him; his arrival is dependent upon our teshuvoh (repentance), May G-d have pity upon us and speed our Redemption.
    As to the Zionists’ argument that Torah-true Jews should become leaders of their movement, I will answer as follows:
    1. How can a G-d fearing Jew stand at the head of a movement that contradicts the fundamentals of our belief in the Redemption?
    2. Torah Jews may not participate in this movement because Zionists will not accept the option of the G-d fearing Jews in the realms of religion and education. Rather, they will continue to follow their own course, and thereafter claim that the G-d fearing Jews, as part of the movement, ratify their views and decisions. Once G-d fearing Jews join the Zionists, many sincere simple Jews will begin to believe that the Zionists’ deeds are approved by the G-d fearing Jews. Even if these G-d fearing Jews later break with the Zionist party and denounce it (provided their protests will be published in the Zionistic press), the effects of their protest will be far weaker than if they have never joined the Zionists in the first place.
    3. No matter what the Zionists claim, in truth they are not interested in G-d fearing Jews joining them, since they do not intend to change their chosen course (of totaling abandoning Torah and mitzvos, making nationalism their entire Judaism). When Rabbonim at the Warsaw assemblies demanded the establishment of an exclusive council of Rabbonim, the Zionists would not agree. Their journalists ridiculed and blasphemed the Rabbonim, mocking them for having dated suggest such an idea. This clearly shows that the Zionists do not wish Torah Jews to interfere with their evil plans; may G-d foil their council and elevate the position of K’lal Yisroel.
    Furthermore, let us evaluate their argument that they strive and make others strive for the benefit their people, while G-d fearing Jews sit idly by. What have they done “for the benefit of our people?”
    I will only mention in passing the great, good deed accomplished by the Zionists in the last three years to benefit their Jewish brothers: Their closing of the shores of the Holy Land to Jews and the ban of property sales unless they are made by Jews who hold Turkish citizenship. Since the beginning of the establishment of the Chovovei Zion they managed to close the shores of the Holy Land to Jews of Russia and Rumania, and they prevented Jews from all countries from buying property and houses, (except from the Turkish). Jews suffered because of this and how they lost money through it. With the founding of the Zionist movement, entry was refused to all Jews, and acquisition was forbidden even to the old-established Jews in the land. This created a barrier between the Jews and the land that had never existed before and humiliated the Jews in the eyes of the non-Jewish inhabitants.
    These worthy goals necessitated huge expenditures which were funded by the collection of half shekel coins and by selling shares. They crave our trust in them and their promises. Yet their personal actions on behalf of their Jewish brethren, other than fund raising, is of little movement.
    But let us see whether the Chovevai Zion group, founded ten years ago in Odessa, did anything for the benefit of our Jewish brothers.
    One of their accomplishments was founding the settlement Kastina. I have been informed by a reliable source who is well acquainted with its inhabitants that there are only a few families who do not have adequate dwellings. Their daily wage for farm labor is a frank and a half, (i.e. a ridiculously small amount, mere pocket money) and they are bitterly poor. Any profit that might be reaped goes to the party. A few families have been placed in “Petach Tikvah”. This is the extent of their benevolence. Any Rav or ordinary Jew does more for the poverty-stricken in his town, extending financial aid and endeavoring to make them independent. (These settlers in Eretz Yisroel) need constant support. Even the settlers who were set up with farm land and all the necessary implements by Baron Hirsch, and for whom he spent more than 10,000 Rubles per person, need constant support, although these settlements were founded twenty years ago. Only individual settlers are self-sufficient, and this also only by the Baron’s generosity).
    The Rabbonim and individual Jews who support the poor in their town do so without publicity, so that, in fact, the public may not be informed of their good deeds. In reality even in the less generous towns, many more paupers are supported than are helped by the Chovevai Zion.
    On the contrary, we must demand that they do much more, considering the great commotion they create and considering that they collect more than 40,000 Rubles annually.
    No measurable gains for our brothers can be disclosed–their actions have been confined to oral and written plans, all blown out of proportion to reality. They pounce upon any hint of opposition like lions on the rampage, hoping to silence him with invective.
    Their speeches cannot create new realities, and they do not blind the eyes of the intelligent people. We are aware that there they do not produce actual results. Do they benefit K’lal Yisroel with their above-mentioned relativity small contribution? Yet they boast that they themselves do and cause others to do deeds for the good of their fellow Jews. How are they not ashamed to speak in this manner, accusing others of lack of good deeds, although in truth the accused do far more than they do, each one in his own city and place. Among us, people take care of the needs of the community and improve the financial lot of their fellow Jew without arousing any public attention.
    May Hashem elevate the position of our brothers B’nai Yisroel and speed our redemption soon in our days.
    Your true friend who desires and waits for G-d’s salvation,

    Sholem Dov Ber
    (The Rashab)

  • Anonymous says:

    Sarah,
    Regarding Lubavitch’s Shitoh on Zionism.
    Rabbi Wolpo wrote a book in hebrew called “Between Light And Darkness”.
    If you go to Beismoshiach.org they have some of the instalments translated to english.
    The author’s email is wolpo@012.net.il or telephone 050-8754674 fax- 08-6600955.
    Even if you are afraid to read his book(you mite think its too extreme) he brings in the back of the sefer a bibleography of sources from the Rebbe’s works which you could look them up yourself.
    Shaul Engel or someone local might sell this book.

  • Anonymous says:

    Please confirm if the post quoting our Rebbeim is genuine!

    If the post re The Shitta of Chabad on Zionism is correct, could you please explain to me the difference between Lubavitch and the Satmerer chasiddim?

    Sarah

  • Anonymous says:

    Rabbi Wolpo is as crazy as the site “Beismoshiach” is. Even Rabbi Heller C.H. labelled Wolpo as a Meshuganah!

    Yank

  • Anonymous says:

    Good morning – Yes this is real chabad (not the watered down secular fake version)

    I (Yank) have selected some very appropriate parts of the Rashabs famous letter- That Mr G. would love to believe doesn’t exist. As it does not fit in with his Zionist school mentality.

    From the Rebbe RASHAB!

    Doesn’t the holy words of the RASHAB totally destroy the argument of the Moshiachists. Are we going to let Hashem decide who should be Moshiach and when Moshiach will arrive or are we going to go down the same tracks as those that the holy Rebbe RASHAB is attacking!

    -The Zionist notion contradicts our hope and yearning that G-d himself will not bring about our Redemption .

    -The past redemptions which were wrought by human beings were therefore incomplete.

    -The redemption through Moshe and Aharon after which further exiles followed, and the redemption through Chananyoh, Michoel, and Azaryoh, although they acted in accordance with the prophecy of Yirmeyohu and other prophets are cases in point.

    -To insure a permanent Redemption from our present exile, we must hope and wait for a deliverance by the Almighty Himself, and not through the hands of one of flesh and blood. Thus only will our redemption be complete.

    -The Zionists true desire is to sever the hearts of the Jewish people from the Torah and mitzvos, G-d forbid, and to debase in their eyes whatever is regarded as holy by our nation.

    -If the Zionist plan to take possession of the land will G-d forbid materialize, they will defile it and disgrace it with their abominations and misdeeds, causing our exile to be lengthened, chas vesholom.

    -After considering these points, dear brothers, do judge whether G-d desires their actions and whether these people will bring about the salvation of K’Lal Yisroel. No!

    -It is this good we want. And that is our only cherished hope. Those who aid the Zionists will in the future be held accountable, for they support those who cause the community to sin.

    -Therefore, anyone who belongs to Hashem’s camp shall not join the evildoers, but on the contrary, he must oppose them as much as he is able to do.

    -Until it shall be G-d’s will to redeem us, we must accept the yoke of exile upon ourselves, since the exile expiates our sins. We must strengthen ourselves to withstand every new wave by fulfilling Torah and mitzvos, as G-d requires of us,

    -Hoping that Hashem will soon bring our redemption and send Moshiach. If he tarries let us wait for him; his arrival is dependent upon our teshuvoh (repentance), May G-d have pity upon us and speed our Redemption.

    -Your true friend who desires and waits for G-d’s salvation,

    Sholem Dov Ber

  • Anonymous says:

    In what year did the Rebbe Rashab write the Anti Zionist letter?

    Sarah

  • Anonymous says:

    It seems there are two opinions.
    a) Long Live The Rebbe our Moshiach!
    b) We want Moshiach now!

    I translate them as follows:-

    a) Not talking when Moshiach should come, but rather announcing who is Moshiach.

    b) A plea for Moshiach (whoever Hashem chooses) to come immediately.

    According to the teachings of the Rebbe as well as the Rashab shouldn’t we focus on the coming of Moshiach (b) rather than making a public fool of ourselves in claiming that chabad has some kind of monoply on who will be Moshiach.

    I”ll choose as the Rashab writes, let’s leave it to Hashem. All we should do is what the Rebbe (as well as all our Rebbeyim) which is to improve our Torah, Mitzvos and Ahavas Yisroel and always remember that WE WANT MOSHIACH NOW! This is clearly what the Rebbe fought for all his life.
    The Yechiniks can do what they like in their own homes but I will follow the Rebbe Rashabs holy words:- “Hoping that Hashem will soon bring our redemption and send Moshiach. If he tarries let us wait for him; his arrival is dependent upon our teshuvoh”
    ——————–

    Less TV’s, more Tseniyos,more respect for our Rabbonim, shorter hair for so called chassidim, less Zionism in Beth Rivkah etc. etc…

  • Anonymous says:

    to all those who object to the zionist slant in beth rivkah the singing of hatikve rachmonah litzlan or celebrating yom hazmaut or anything else including havarah sefardit hang on a second i dont understand isnt mulik a sheliach or isnt he im confused if he is then keep quiet its what the rebee wants i think something along the lines of the rebees shluchim know whats right. if he isnt well then our rabbonim who everyone considers to be the rebees sheluchim have not sanctioned him for his actions they are therfor by their silence condoning his shita if thats the case how dare anyone complain when the rebees sheluchim say its ok you cant have thecake and eat it to.the fact that our rabbonim/sheluchim find yechi objectionable and hatikvah ok is clearly what the rebee wants by virtue of sheliach shel odom komoso confused ? yeh me too

  • Anonymous says:

    Talking about aveiros.

    My mother tells me how we have changed!
    The yearly Yeshivah Dinner totally mixed with Rabbi Groner sitting next to a non frum woman!
    Yeshivah College giving its students milk daily and it was not Chalav Yisrael!

    Those were the days………

    Rivkah

  • Anonymous says:

    if rabbi groner was sitting next to a woman it was probobly better that she was NOT frum wouldnt you say

  • Anonymous says:

    I Suppose it woiuld depend on age and looks 🙂

    Barry

  • Anonymous says:

    i bet she didnt say yechi

  • Anonymous says:

    Was Groner drinking the non kosher milk with the non frum lady who didn’t say Yechi?

    PS. Has anyone heard from Elka?

  • Anonymous says:

    dont be silly it was a fleishik dinner under sholom gutnicks very mehadrin standards

  • Anonymous says:

    Do you mean the food or the lady THAT were under Rabbi Sholom Gutnick?

  • Anonymous says:

    I think the Groners, Telsner, and Kolel Hanhola are playing cat and mouse game.[When no one is around we will say yechi. Or only in kolel not the shule or only by somebody who says in such a soft voice so that we don’t irritae anybody]
    I spoke to a Litvishe fellow about the sign in shule and he was also at the mincha when the “big 3” got booted from the shule for saying Yechi. And I asked him what he thought about having a yechi sign in Shule and when you enter you have a notice instructing you not to anounce anything in between the lines{i.e. Yechi}. He said alot of people thought to themselves, they wont tell you this, that its a contradiction “Tartai Disasrai”, on one hand we have a Yechi sign promoting Yechi and then we have a notice instructing People not to say Yechi?! An oxy Moron!
    I have more respect for Soleveitchik, Molik Gorevitch, Moshe Treibish, Kramer and others who don’t try to play both sides of the fence.
    As opposed to the Groners, Telsner and kolel Hanhola etc. who play both sides of the fence. The Yechi sign in back of Shule, However no Anouncing Yechi. C.T. Groner and T. Telsner signed a psak after Gimel Tamuz that cleary says we should Tell the world the Rebbe is Moshiach and the Rebbe encouraged Yechi.
    This compromised behaviour reflects itself in Tzniyus, Limudai Kodesh and many other aspects in our community.
    Such compromised behaviour is what led to the formation of the movements of liberal Judiasm or in America Conservative Judiasm.
    If you check out todays hayom Yom it says clearly that Rabonim and masters of Torah are the eyes and heads of the thousands of Jews. “AND WHEN THE HEAD IS HEALTHY THE BODY IS HEALTHY!

  • Anonymous says:

    another satisfied customer such nachas

  • Anonymous says:

    how come nobody has adressed the issues raised by the confused writer concerning rabbis telsner and groners silence with regards to muliks zionistic manipulation of our so called lubavitch girls school the silents by everyone is deafaning

  • Anonymous says:

    question to critics of Mr G & Beth rivkah re ‘zionism’:

    When the Rebbe hosted Zalman Shazzar & multiple other ‘dignitaries’ representing the State of Israel, did he publicise that he was meeting them as private individuals & not as representing the State?

  • Anonymous says:

    I’m for Mr G.

    If the “blacks” get their way the very people whom the rebbe wanted to attract will remove their kids. And guess what? Most of them are the fee payers. Full fee payers unlike the whining whinging nuts who don’t pay their way, want everyone else to fork out on their behalf. Yes, these louts will bury their “all black, no compromise”, school for the Lubabs. And then what? Fight over the carcass of a one proud girls school which catered for the needs of the “shtot”.

  • Anonymous says:

    We have to accept Zionism which our Rebbeim were totally opossed to to atract the “shtot”. How many other compromises do we need to do. How many girls from chassidishe homes (the ones without TV!) are growing up dressing and behaving as Yavnah girls and worse!

    Apparently in Addas the biggest insult a girl can be given is to be told that she looks like an Ohel Chana girl!

  • Anonymous says:

    since when do the rantings of the anti semitic adas congregation matter i take it as a compliment to get insulted by them

  • Anonymous says:

    If we need to knock people more religous than us (Adas- Bet Hatalmud) rather than those less religous we have a major problem.

    Are Adas anti semitic or are those that hate other frum jews anti semitic??

    Something to think about!

    YB

  • Anonymous says:

    It’s mush easier to knock Adas than to accept that many o.c. girls do not dress befitting a chassidishe girl.

    I know of 3 chassidishe families who have tried very hard to send their children to Adas but Adas will not accept them.

    I envy Adas.

    ELKA

  • Anonymous says:

    Elka

    will they accept meshichisten at addass??

    if not, why?

  • Anonymous says:

    I have no idea if they would accept Meshichisten at Adas but they would be crazy to! Why would they want to ruin what I hear is an authentic Chassidishe school.

    By the way are there Meshichsten still around that are school age – I hear unfortunately most have graduated to drugs etc.?

    Ber

  • Anonymous says:

    I have no idea if they would accept Meshichisten at Adas but they would be crazy to! Why would they want to ruin what I hear is an authentic Chassidishe school.

    By the way are there Meshichsten still around that are school age – I hear unfortunately most have graduated to drugs etc.?

    Ber

  • Anonymous says:

    Anonymous said…
    since when do the rantings of the anti semitic adas congregation matter i take it as a compliment to get insulted by them

    29 February, 2008

    David We should be embarrassed by this sick post! Please delete it.
    It would fit in perfecly in THE STUREM (which was the Nazi propoganda paper)

    Shame on the poster. It sounds as the same sick mind wrote wrote about Taliban on Oak Rd.

    People like this is what is holding Moshiach up from coming!

    Yank

  • admin says:

    I have removed another comment that is a low, personal attack, as well as being off topic.

    Closing the blog will not close the debate, and will only cause these same feelings that exist within our community to shift underground, to other blogs, to the discussions that take place in and around shul, etc.

    It pains me to see so many instances of people attacking others personally just because they don’t like what they say, hiding behind anonymity, and people unable to sustain a theological debate in a mature and respectful way. In a way, this vindicates what I wrote in the original post.

    I am now closing this post for further comment. Will have to think about how (if at all) I can facilitate some meaningful and constructive discussion on topics that are clearly important to people.

  • Anonymous says:

    The Adasniks do not believe in the whole Moshiach inyan!

    So aren’t they anti semites!

    Yechi

  • Anonymous says:

    Their woman dress like Taliban (according to this blog!) and they are anti-semites. Maybe we should shoot em?

    Mechiyas Amalek!

  • Anonymous says:

    According to your wrarped logic 99.9% of Jews are anti-semites. What has believing in Moshiach got to do with all the Yechi nonsence!

    It’s time some of you grew up and got yourselves a life. And you Werdiger don’t you have anything better to do with your time than allow such rubbish as these Yechi looneys are posting. Every man and his dog know they are crazy!

    Norman Rosenbaum

  • Anonymous says:

    Mazel Tov!

    At least we have someone who is a man rather than a coward, and puts his name to his comment.

    Long live Norman!

  • Anonymous says:

    David,

    This blog has become counter productive. No useful purpose is being served.

    Look at that last post in reference to Norman and his family. Way out of line. We think this whole topic derves to relegated to the dustbins of history. Shameful!

    A blight on our community.

    Collective members of DaMinyan.

  • admin says:

    I have spoken to Norman Rosenbaum (brother of the late Yankel HYD) and he confirms that he was NOT the writer of a recent post.

  • Yossi says:

    And now Chaim Waks has the chutzpah to slap Rabbi Telsner in the face in shul on yom tov!! What a disgrace! If it happened in any other shul there would be an uproar but in Yeshivah does everyone stand by?

Leave a Reply

Time limit is exhausted. Please reload CAPTCHA.